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Eze 20:10 Therefore I caused them to go forth out of the land of Egypt, and brought them into the wilderness.
Eze 20:11 And I gave them my statutes, and showed them my judgments, which if a man does, he shall even live by them.
Eze 20:12 Moreover also I gave them my sabbaths, to be a sign between me and them, that they might know that I am the LORD that sanctifies them.


Neh 9:13 You came down also upon mount Sinai, and spoke with them from heaven, and gave them right ordinances, and true laws, good statutes and commandments:
Neh 9:14 And made known unto them your holy sabbath, and commanded them precepts, statutes, and laws, by the hand of Moses your servant:


Just a thought here,if the Sabbath as a commandment to keep in a certain way was from creation why do we learn it was given to Israel in the Wilderness?

Just a thought here,if the Sabbath as a commandment to keep in a certain way was from creation why do we learn it was given to Israel in the Wilderness?



The anwer to that question is the same as to:
Why did God give the law the way He did at mt sinai,

Because before that event every one did what was good in own eyes.
From adam to Moses there was not a law in stone or specified, altho abraham kept His ordinances and statues , bible sais.
Wich where they?
We don t know, because it does n t say.
But he was obedient to God that;s for sure.
God found it neccesary to give the people a clear guideline and the shabbath was a token of that convenant, same as rainbow was to noach. Noach was also given instructions after the flood......3 rules.
But it seems that whatever God did or say, the people did m t listen.
So after Egypt God gave them THE law and a system to live by.....so they would remember He was theyre god and creator.

But as we know that did n t help either.
The law as given did not anull the promise to abraham, so that is what God was going to do.Bring someone into the world (Himself in the flesh) to solve the whole "mess" He was the seed promised to abraham and in Him should all nations be blessed.
Now about your questiom.
In the beginning God said that He blessed the 7th day as a special day.
Not that He was tired from creating, but to show us something.
I think that set apart day pointed to His rest he would give when all has been said and done!
And later at mt sinai he included that day in the convenant, again to point to His rest, the whole in between periode of time was (imo) telling menkind, that we could never please God the way He wanted it.
He gave menkind chance after chance, while He knew they/we could n t live up to it.....make us aware we needed to be saved from that burden.
Because God is a holy God therefor it would be a burden to please Him all the way.

The bible also tells us that in the end of time as we know it, shabbath will still be His day. But then a day that will never end!
We will all be on :cloud9: for ever and ever.......

EMJE

(12-31-2008 02:48 PM)Rose of Shushan Wrote: [ -> ]Eze 20:10 Therefore I caused them to go forth out of the land of Egypt, and brought them into the wilderness.



Just a thought here,if the Sabbath as a commandment to keep in a certain way was from creation why do we learn it was given to Israel in the Wilderness?

My thinking on this interesting question leads to another question, namely why did God give the Law at all, if it was, in 6 of the 10 commandments at least. predated by the Code of Hammurabi.

It seems to me that God was not giving new information, for the fact of conscience (which I hold is man's innate moral sense not the voice of God) means that men know this already. If men are to live in communitues a certain kind if behaviour is necessary, and as men had been in communities since Adam, they knew this. This does not mean that men ever lived up to even their own consciences or even obeyed their own rules. I speak here ojnly of moral knowledge not moral goodness

In my view the Law was given to Israel not for new information, but for God to assert to the People that HE was the first and primary Author of it.

I think this fact is a necessary to accept as otherwise, when we realize as simple fact that moral law is not unique and preexisted Moses, we have no answer to those who reject the LAw of GOd because many of the same commandfments pre existed Moses. They think that as men invented the Code of Hammurabi etc so Moses or a commitee of hebrew priests invented them.

I do tend to dispute that the law was given about guidance primarily.

It is impossible and stirs up sin, so how does it guide. it only condemns, as St Paul said and i experienced.

I think the context of events give a clue.

They have just been delivered from slavery in egypt. This was solely by God's own grace. The Law was given to highlight that the people were trapped in a far worse and far deeper slavery, namely that to sin. Their could only be deliverance from this by his grace also

My old pastor once said that the Law was about gratitude for deliverance, so wasn't heavy and condemning at all. But how can this be? They were not grateful, indeed they died in the desert because of this, and they had no means of getting so as they were flesh not renewed in christ.

The Law as guidance might lead the horse to water but it cannot make him drink

Rose,

You are correct. I see no mention of any feasts there. However being ever curious, I also know that Revelation refers to the last days and judgement. What does this refer too:
Rev 19:9 And he saith unto me, Write, Blessed [are] they which are called unto the marriage supper of the Lamb. And he saith unto me, These are the true sayings of God.

Is this in reference to a feast or does it mean something totally different?

(12-31-2008 09:18 PM)carl37 Wrote: [ -> ]Rose,

You are correct. I see no mention of any feasts there. However being ever curious, I also know that Revelation refers to the last days and judgement. What does this refer too:
Rev 19:9 And he saith unto me, Write, Blessed [are] they which are called unto the marriage supper of the Lamb. And he saith unto me, These are the true sayings of God.

Is this in reference to a feast or does it mean something totally different?

I believe it refers to something quite different. I am not all that convinced it involves food, but that is my personal opinion. Often times I see the artist's depictions of a long table set for the bride, on a nice beach. I think it's quite creative, but not very realistic. I base my opinion on John 6.

Joh 6:35 And Jesus said to them, I am the bread of life: he that comes to me shall never hunger; and he that believes on me shall never thirst.
Joh 6:51 I am the living bread which came down from heaven: if any man eat of this bread, he shall live for ever: and the bread that I will give is my flesh, which I will give for the life of the world.
Joh 6:52 The Jews therefore strove among themselves, saying, How can this man give us his flesh to eat?
Joh 6:53 Then Jesus said to them, Truly, truly, I say to you, Except you eat the flesh of the Son of man, and drink his blood, you have no life in you.
Joh 6:54 Whoever eats my flesh, and drinks my blood, has eternal life; and I will raise him up at the last day.
Joh 6:55 For my flesh is meat indeed, and my blood is drink indeed.
Joh 6:56 He that eats my flesh, and drinks my blood, dwells in me, and I in him.
Joh 6:57 As the living Father has sent me, and I live by the Father: so he that eats me, even he shall live by me.
Joh 6:58 This is that bread which came down from heaven: not as your fathers did eat manna, and are dead: he that eats of this bread shall live for ever.
Joh 6:59 These things said he in the synagogue, as he taught in Capernaum.
Joh 6:60 Many therefore of his disciples, when they had heard this, said, This is an hard saying; who can hear it?
Joh 6:61 When Jesus knew in himself that his disciples murmured at it, he said to them, Does this offend you?
Joh 6:62 What and if you shall see the Son of man ascend up where he was before?
Joh 6:63 It is the spirit that vivifies; the flesh profits nothing: the words that I speak to you, they are spirit, and they are life.
Joh 6:64 But there are some of you that believe not. For Jesus knew from the beginning who they were that believed not, and who should betray him.
Joh 6:65 And he said, Therefore said I to you, that no man can come to me, except it were given to him of my Father.
Joh 6:66 From that time many of his disciples went back, and walked no more with him.
Joh 6:67 Then said Jesus to the twelve, Will you also go away?
Joh 6:68 Then Simon Peter answered him, Lord, to whom shall we go? you have the words of eternal life.
Joh 6:69 And we believe and are sure that you are that Christ, the Son of the living God.

Carl,

the revelation verse you presented could well be related to the end-times like you said.
I am reminded of another passage ,also in Matthew with a similiar theme


Mat 22:2 The kingdom of heaven is like unto a certain king, who made a marriage for his son,
Mat 22:3 And sent forth his servants to call them that were bidden to the wedding: and they would not come.
Mat 22:4 Again, he sent forth other servants, saying, Tell them who are bidden, Behold, I have prepared my dinner: my oxen and my fatlings are killed, and all things are ready: come unto the marriage.
Mat 22:5 But they made light of it, and went their ways, one to his farm, another to his merchandise:
Mat 22:6 And the remnant took his servants, and treated them shamefully, and slew them.
Mat 22:7 But when the king heard thereof, he was angry: and he sent forth his armies, and destroyed those murderers, and burned up their city.
Mat 22:8 Then said he to his servants, The wedding is ready, but they who were bidden were not worthy.
Mat 22:9 Go you therefore into the highways, and as many as you shall find, bid to the marriage.
Mat 22:10 So those servants went out into the highways, and gathered together as many as they found, both bad and good: and the wedding was furnished with guests.
Mat 22:11 And when the king came in to see the guests, he saw there a man who had not on a wedding garment:
Mat 22:12 And he said unto him, Friend, how came you in here not having a wedding garment? And he was speechless.
Mat 22:13 Then said the king to the servants, Bind him hand and foot, and take him away, and cast him into outer darkness; there shall be weeping and gnashing of teeth.
Mat 22:14 For many are called, but few are chosen.[color=#4682B4]
and also

Luk 14:16 Then said he unto him, A certain man gave a great supper, and bade many:
Luk 14:17 And sent his servant at supper time to say to them that were bidden, Come; for all things are now ready.
Luk 14:18 And they all with one consent began to make excuse. The first said unto him, I have bought a piece of ground, and I must go and see it: I pray you have me excused.
Luk 14:19 And another said, I have bought five yoke of oxen, and I go to examine them: I pray you have me excused.
Luk 14:20 And another said, I have married a wife, and therefore I cannot come.
Luk 14:21 So that servant came, and showed his lord these things. Then the Master of the house being angry said to his servant, Go out quickly into the streets and lanes of the city, and bring in here the poor, and the maimed, and the lame, and the blind.
Luk 14:22 And the servant said, Lord, it is done as you have commanded, and yet there is room.
Luk 14:23 And the lord said unto the servant, Go out into the highways and hedges, and compel them to come in, that my house may be filled.
Luk 14:24 For I say unto you, That none of those men who were bidden shall taste of my supper.

The claim concerning original Hebrew manuscripts or translating from original Hebrew manuscripts is not academically accurate. The supposed Hebrew Matthews or Shem Tob Matthew are from the 1400-1500 range CE. Precisely, ShemTob or Shem Tov is dated 1380, while DuTillet and Muenster are about 1550. Together they make up the "Middle Ages Matthews" but, they are very different, and that is one of the ironies.

Hugh Schonfeld and James Trimm mostly push DuTillet. Michael Rood and George Howard promote the Shem Tob version. The Greek Matthew is from the 250-400 CE range. And so it goes. See: http://www.seekgod.ca/trfactor.htm and http://www.seekgod.ca/trfactor2.htm

Shem Tob's "Matthew"is nothing more than an altered medieval text, which is a corrupt copy of the Latin text, which was originally copied from the Greek. Most legitimate textual critics have all but ignored this middle age manuscript.

The truth is that uninformed believers are being led by unbelievers to accept an altered anti-Christian version of Matthew that was included in the writing titled "Even Bohan" or "The Touchstone." This document was authored by Shem Tov, an unbelieving anti-Christian Jewish writer who some have referred to as a theologian, who resided in Spain during the fourteenth century. His copy of Hebrew Matthew has anti-Christian polemical commentary by him throughout the text.

The Shem Tov Matthew "translation" never identifies Jesus as the Messiah, gives John the Baptist an exalted role, Jesus' role in forgiving sins is omitted, and Jesus' ability to save all His people from their sins is also eliminated. It is also written in this "translation" that preaching the Gospel to the gentiles is of the anti-christ.

Just a brief comparison of phrases from the Shem Tov to the KJB, reveals these anti-Christian alterations to Scriptural Truth. The Shem Tov Hebrew Matthew quotes are from George Howard's 'Hebrew Gospel of Matthew', published by Mercer University Press (1995).

In this passage Jesus is made equal to the scribes or sages.

Mat 7:29 "For he taught them as one having authority, and not as the scribes."

Shem Tov "because he was preaching to them with great power, not as the rest of the sages"

In this passage the coming of a future Kingdom is eliminated

Mat 6:10 "Thy kingdom come. Thy will be done in earth, as it is in heaven."

Shem Tov "may your kingdom be blessed; may your will be done in heaven and on earth"

In this passage the preaching of the gospel is eliminated.

Mat 11:5 "The blind receive their sight, and the lame walk, the lepers are cleansed, and the deaf hear, the dead are raised up, and the poor have the gospel preached to them."

Shem Tov "the blind see, the lame walk, the lepers are cleansed, the deaf hear, the dead are revived and the poor are acquitted."

In this passage the temple is exalted above Christ

Mat 12:6 "But I say unto you, That in this place is one greater than the temple."

Shem Tov"Truly I say to you that the temple is greater than this"

In this passage Elijah becomes the savior.

Mat 17:11 "And Jesus answered and said unto them, Elias truly shall first come, and restore all things. 12 But I say unto you, That Elias is come already, and they knew him not, but have done unto him whatsoever they listed. Likewise shall also the Son of man suffer of them. 13 Then the disciples understood that he spake unto them of John the Baptist."

Shem Tov "11. He answered them and said: Indeed Elijah will come and will save all the world. 12 "I say to you, he has already come, they did not know him, and they did to him according to their desire. (So) they will do to the Son of Man. 13 "Then the disciples understood that regarding John the Baptizer he was saying this""

Mat 18:11 "For the Son of man is come to save that which was lost."

Shem Tov 18:11, "and the Son of Man has stopped saving the enemy."

In these passages the Deity of Christ is eliminated.

Mat 19:28 "And Jesus said unto them, Verily I say unto you, That ye which have followed me, in the regeneration when the Son of man shall sit in the throne of his glory,..."

Shem Tov "Jesus said: Truly I say to you who follow me, in the day of judgement when man sits upon the throne of his glory you also will sit upon the twelve thrones of the twelve tribes of Israel." ***Jesus=Yeshu

Mat 20:30 "...when they heard that Jesus passed by, cried out, saying, Have mercy on us, O Lord, thou son of David."

Shem Tov"...It was said to them: The prophet Jesus from Nazareth is coming. Then they cried out saying: Son of David, have mercy on us." ***Jesus=Yeshu

Mat 28:9 ".. Jesus met them, saying, All hail. And they came and held him by the feet, and worshipped him."

Shem Tov "As they were going Jesus passed before them saying: May the Name deliver you. They came near to him, bowed down to him, and worshipped him" ***Please Note Jesus = Yeshu ; the Name =haShem

In this passage preaching of the Gospel of Jesus Christ becomes, "the Anti-Christ" and "abomination of desolation."

Mat 24:14-16 "And this gospel of the kingdom shall be preached in all the world for a witness unto all nations; and then shall the end come. When ye therefore shall see the abomination of desolation spoken of by Daniel the prophet, stand in the holy place, (whoso readeth, let him understand Then let them which be in Judaea flee into the mountains: "

Shem Tov "And this gospel, that is, evungili, will be preached In all the earth for a witness concerning me to all the nations and then the end will come. This is the Anti-Christ and this is the abomination which desolates which was spoken of by Daniel [as] standing in the holy place. Let the one who reads understand. Then those who are in Juda, let them flee to the mountains."

In the rabbinic writings (talmud) that the word Yeshu, found translated in the Shem Tov, has the same connotations as is found in the Toledot Yeshu. Briefly, it means may his name be blotted out.

Hardly something for Christians.

For more on this please see: http://www.seekgod.ca/embracebible.htm and http://www.seekgod.ca/embrachrist.htm