SeekGod.ca Discussion Forum

(07-21-2011 06:13 PM)Mary Wrote: [ -> ]

(07-21-2011 12:27 PM)shepherdess7 Wrote: [ -> ]I am wondering, if anyone here, has studied more than the feast? Let us take for instance, the overt use of pagan names for the Savior, The Father, and the truth of who they are? Why continue to call them Jesus, christ, or God when neither is the truth of who they are? From my understanding, MOST Messianics do some sort of observance of the feasts, simply because it helps them remember what Yahusha did when He was impaled for our sins. He is our Pesah. His spirit was given to us on Shabu'ot. He will come with a Teruah. He has covered our sins (Yom Kippurim), He is coming back to Sukkot (dwell, gather, tabernacle) with His people, the people who are called by His Name, which incidentally, never has been Jesus. I'm not Messianic, but if I had to choose, I'd rather be one of them than a Christian.

There are a number of threads and even articles` on this site which deal with the "name" issue - if the feasts help the messianics remember what "Yashua" did when He was "impaled for our sins" I can only say, as a Christian, why would they need anything to remind them?

This is because here is something that Christians should do, and do do, often, and regularly in remembrance of our Lord: observe The Lord's supper, and once, be baptised, as a symbol of our personal repentance and belief in Jesus and His death and resurrection, and that we are reborn in Him. These are two ordinances of Christianity that we do for the following reasons:

1. Each was instituted by Christ.
2. Each was practised by the Apostles in Acts.
3. Each is explained in the Epistles.

The Lord's Supper is particularly relevant to your post, because Jesus said specifically:
Luke 22: 19 - 20: And he took bread, and gave thanks, and brake it, and gave unto them, saying, This is my body which is given for you: this do in remembrance of me.
Likewise also the cup after supper, saying, This cup is the new testament in my blood, which is shed for you.

Also1 Corinthians 11: 23-26 :
For I have received of the Lord that which also I delivered unto you, That the Lord Jesus the same night in which he was betrayed took bread:
And when he had given thanks, he brake it, and said, Take, eat: this is my body, which is broken for you: this do in remembrance of me.
After the same manner also he took the cup, when he had supped, saying, This cup is the new testament in my blood: this do ye, as oft as ye drink it, in remembrance of me.
For as often as ye eat this bread, and drink this cup, ye do shew the Lord's death till he come.

This is what Christians should do in remembrance of Jesus Christ our Lord. However, I think it is impossible for someone who loves Jesus to forget Him.

(07-22-2011 05:37 AM)Mary Wrote: [ -> ]

(07-21-2011 06:13 PM)Mary Wrote: [ -> ]

(07-21-2011 12:27 PM)shepherdess7 Wrote: [ -> ]I am wondering, if anyone here, has studied more than the feast? Let us take for instance, the overt use of pagan names for the Savior, The Father, and the truth of who they are? Why continue to call them Jesus, christ, or God when neither is the truth of who they are? From my understanding, MOST Messianics do some sort of observance of the feasts, simply because it helps them remember what Yahusha did when He was impaled for our sins. He is our Pesah. His spirit was given to us on Shabu'ot. He will come with a Teruah. He has covered our sins (Yom Kippurim), He is coming back to Sukkot (dwell, gather, tabernacle) with His people, the people who are called by His Name, which incidentally, never has been Jesus. I'm not Messianic, but if I had to choose, I'd rather be one of them than a Christian.

There are a number of threads and even articles` on this site which deal with the "name" issue - if the feasts help the messianics remember what "Yashua" did when He was "impaled for our sins" I can only say, as a Christian, why would they need anything to remind them?

This is because here is something that Christians should do, and do do, often, and regularly in remembrance of our Lord: observe The Lord's supper, and once, be baptised, as a symbol of our personal repentance and belief in Jesus and His death and resurrection, and that we are reborn in Him. These are two ordinances of Christianity that we do for the following reasons:

1. Each was instituted by Christ.
2. Each was practised by the Apostles in Acts.
3. Each is explained in the Epistles.

The Lord's Supper is particularly relevant to your post, because Jesus said specifically:
Luke 22: 19 - 20: And he took bread, and gave thanks, and brake it, and gave unto them, saying, This is my body which is given for you: this do in remembrance of me.
Likewise also the cup after supper, saying, This cup is the new testament in my blood, which is shed for you.

Also1 Corinthians 11: 23-26 :
For I have received of the Lord that which also I delivered unto you, That the Lord Jesus the same night in which he was betrayed took bread:
And when he had given thanks, he brake it, and said, Take, eat: this is my body, which is broken for you: this do in remembrance of me.
After the same manner also he took the cup, when he had supped, saying, This cup is the new testament in my blood: this do ye, as oft as ye drink it, in remembrance of me.
For as often as ye eat this bread, and drink this cup, ye do shew the Lord's death till he come.

This is what Christians should do in remembrance of Jesus Christ our Lord. However, I think it is impossible for someone who loves Jesus to forget Him.

I would like to add - regarding this article - that it is a NOW word for a NOW season on the 18th of this month is the beginning of the Jewish New Year RosH the Feast of Trumpets and Feast of Moons begin in this season the teaching - word - is for TODAY - and not just an assembly of facts to inform, though I hope they do, nor are they meant to tittilate, which i hope they dont.

to Israel and for us it is a time of personal identification and offering to God - a time of the hope of a new beginning with Him - and because of the nature of promise IN THIS WORD - is also meant to SHOW - what OBEDIENCE produces - at such a time of this - my earnest desire for you all - is not to miss TODAY Gods moment to fill your life with the hope of the promise inherent in this offering.

For this word was first given me 13 years ago - and for this time it is the beginning of itas fullfillment.

The Returning Light to Gods Church

Ps 81:1-5. The Returning Light to Gods Church
Is a Psalm spoken out by priests and Levites on the morning offerings of the Feast of New Moons, the Feast of Trumpets. Psalm 29 is sung in the evening. It is Celebrated at the start of the month involving the burnt offering – the WHOLE consecration and offering.

Important: ALL the festivals are held according to Mosaic Law and to be celebrated on the same day of each month. It is necessary therefore to fix the feast at commencement of the month. Timed and established not by the solar calendar but according to the LUNAR calendar

The feast is determined by the APPROACH of the NEW moon. It is
determined not by calculation or working out when, but by PERSONAL OBSERVATION Not worked out by them, man, but by the course set by God.

Personal observation – was determined by the watchmen, who were placed upon the heights that surrounded Jerusalem. Placed there to watch the skies. The High priest sent each watchman there and each had to watch from his own vantage point.

As soon as any one of the watchmen detected the FIRST sight of the moon approaching – he would light a fire atop his place of watch on the overlooking hill, and go to the high priest. Then each in turn – as they EACH personally saw, the moon begin to appear from their own position and vantage point, they would also light their own individual fires atop their hill, watch place and go and present themselves before the high priest. This was their testimony and witness to their OWN PERSONAL observation.

As all the other watchmen came forth one by one each bearing his own testimony – theirs would then be a COLLECTIVE observation. The High priest would then --- and only then CONSECRATE that day – made HOLY this natural dimension of time.

This was a CELEBRATION of the RETURNING LIGHT OF THE MOON (Gods goodness!!!). – and His goodness is directly connected to His GLORY.

The moon gets its light from the sun and reflects the suns rays to earth. Only 7% of the light is reflected, as the surface of the moon is dark. But 7 is the number of perfection. It is enough, it is perfectly sufficient.

Genesis 1:16 God made two great lights, the greater light to govern the day, the lesser light to govern the night. The greater light is the sun. The lesser light is the moon. The greater light is the Son, the lesser light the church, reflecting the Son.

Psalm 81 is a celebration of the RETURNING light of the moon

The moon in ages past has been eclipsed but is NOW RETURNING and COMING to its FULNESS

I say it again – "hear O Israel, hear O church, hear o ye lands, hear all ye peoples, races and kindren kinds, hear all he nations voices, mountains and rivers, hear all ye earth unto and beyond to its very ends, pillars and foundations.!!!"

The moon in ages past has been eclipsed but is NOW RETURNING and COMING to its FULNESS- the sky of Gods plan - set in place and motion before a single foot was formed or a single footprint recorded on earth below

The light of the church has been darkened but is now (prophetically) appearing and moving to fullness – it is so because – THESE times are set on course BY GOD and NOT by man.
Christ the light in his church and the world.

Ps 81:3 - a ram’s horn is sounded at the start of the new moon and when the moon is FULL at the feast
The result of the consecrating period is a HOLY time, God ordained.
The signal beacons atop the hill COMMENCE at Mount Olives

It is wonderful to see the City Jerusalem below IN THE VALLEY ringed with fire and every hilltop is a signal the HIGH places are held by God - A God initiated sign to the inhabitants

The fires that are seen are not just upon the hills but seen of EVERY believer in the valley and it will spread. As this is a night time scene, as the fire spreads in the witness in the hearts of the believers IN the valley this fire, this light CONSUMES the darkness. It’s at night for it is a NIGHT time watch. Darkness decreases, fire increases, more room made for God, more substance to burn, greater recovery of territory for God. The moon is always seen in the biblical light of PRESTAGING events of great importance.

The New moon is reckoned by Individual observation, being ready and watching, this forms a COLLECTIVE witness before the High priest, it is a CONCECRATED HOLY place and TIME, the signal SURROUNDS showing a COMPLETE witness, it spreads, its increases, it consumes, more place for God, more places to watch for him created…and so on…..Please hear…it is a time SET APART for GOD, a TIME SET APART BY GOD

An example of the collective collective witness in the NT came AFTER a time of mocking ACTS 2:14

(a) Peter stood up WITH the 11

(B) Acts 3:11 while he beggar HELD onto John

© The lost coin – the WHOLE house was swept clean AS she searched for that precious coin, which would MAKE her bracelet COMPLETE – holiness, the sweeping was the result, the product of the search.

The signal from God came with the rams horn – signifying and pronouncing – a SIGN of Gods movement in HEAVEN, movement of the next phase of the His Plan Kings horn used to ANNOINT Kings and for the PURPOSE of calling TOGETHER
V3 decree – ordinance
- statute
A sign of SETTING up something
V4 a DECREE is a law or edict an ENACTMENT of a KING

Carried to distant lands and places – a herald
A pronouncement of war or peace
Given at assemblies, meeting places and gates, before people, leaders and before ALL gods.

ORDENANCES have with them the idea of imparting grace
V5 Statute is a testimony – a rule of grace and its practice shows and depicts and points the WAY to Him a testimony of Him

EXAMPLE used is Joseph Dt 33:13/14

V13 blessing of the land – is part of the expectation
- Heaven above, deep waters
- Shows height and depth shows – EXTENT
V14 – Best / finest
V15- choicest – fruitfulness
V16 – best – fullness/favor and dwelling
Shows forth HIS excellence
Last v14 finest moon can yield – you are Gods moon
Vegetables, the produce of the ground
Required a full lunar month to bring forth to perfection

As the moon PRODUCES dew that is favourable to vegetation to yield produce The presence of God within the Returning light of His church will produce the right conditions for earth yield, His harvest
Growth, perfecting
Bringing forth from the land – EVERY MONTH – every month
Psalm 81 is a response to Psalm 80: verses 3; 7; 19

A CONTINUOS response a continuous INCREASE, INCREASING
V3 O God
V7 O God Almighty
V19 O Lord God Almighty
All this I obtained this 10 years ago ready to fall into place and align with the other witnesses. I feel its time is near.

Let a thing be established out of the mouths of TWO witnesses – an article read over the past few days – is that witness.

Lord, by your grace alone, you light the testimony of your own truth and fire in our hearts - we look and search for you - but Lord, not at our behest but at yours - may ours be the place of inward observance, detecting the high things of god, coming down and alighting as a Holy white dove and fire in the hope of our hearts - Lord we look for you - your time draws nigh and NIGH, NOW IS OUR TIME to draw NIGH, NEAR, NEARER still to YOU.

(07-21-2011 12:27 PM)shepherdess7 Wrote: [ -> ]I am wondering, if anyone here, has studied more than the feast? Let us take for instance, the overt use of pagan names for the Savior, The Father, and the truth of who they are? Why continue to call them Jesus, christ, or God when neither is the truth of who they are? From my understanding, MOST Messianics do some sort of observance of the feasts, simply because it helps them remember what Yahusha did when He was impaled for our sins. He is our Pesah. His spirit was given to us on Shabu'ot. He will come with a Teruah. He has covered our sins (Yom Kippurim), He is coming back to Sukkot (dwell, gather, tabernacle) with His people, the people who are called by His Name, which incidentally, never has been Jesus. I'm not Messianic, but if I had to choose, I'd rather be one of them than a Christian.

As Mary noted there are all manner of articles on my website, as well as threads regarding all the topics you mention. It would be Scriptural to speak in the language people reading normally understand. In other words mixing in hebrew or other without explanation is lost to the reader. Paul wrote:

1Co 14:19 Yet in the church I had rather speak five words with my understanding, that by my voice I might teach others also, than ten thousand words in an unknown tongue.
1Co 14:20 Brethren, be not children in understanding: howbeit in malice be ye children, but in understanding be men.

Doing 'some sort of observance' of the feasts violates the Mosaic law which those same people would say should be kept. God didn't tell Israel to do some sort of observance. To not do as He told them was to incur the curses. Jesus is already tabernacling with those who belong to Him. He doesn't need to 'come back' to do that. He fulfilled those very specific feasts as He Himself said He came to fulfill.

Eph 3:17 That Christ may dwell in your hearts by faith; that ye, being rooted and grounded in love,

dwell G2730
κατοικέω
katoikeō
Thayer Definition:
1) to dwell, settle
1a) metaphorically divine powers, influences, etc., are said to dwell in his soul, to pervade, prompt, govern it
2) to dwell in, inhabit
2a) God is said to dwell in the temple, i.e. to be always present for worshippers
Part of Speech: verb
A Related Word by Thayer’s/Strong’s Number: from G2596 and G3611
Citing in TDNT: 5:153, 674

1Jn 4:13 Hereby know we that we dwell in him, and he in us, because he hath given us of his Spirit.

Joh 14:23 Jesus answered and said unto him, If a man love me, he will keep my words: and my Father will love him, and we will come unto him, and make our abode with him.
Joh 14:24 He that loveth me not keepeth not my sayings: and the word which ye hear is not mine, but the Father's which sent me.

It would be helpful to you to take the time to read the forum rules, as well as do a brief introduction in the INtroduction section, and then actually take time to read the threads so you don't come across as a spammer or someone who merely is going to post with full agenda being to disparage Christians and Christ and promote some form or Hebrew roots or messianic beliefs.

Thank you.

No Vic - it is something written by myself - if it were another’s I would have made that plain - so not to take credit where none is due - and to honour those who write.

The article I refer to is generally information and perspective of the feast itself.

I am not saying we should do this - but the feast is a type in itself - certain principles, themes and truths within it have their own focus on what is happening or to happen - it was not my intention to suggest one should copy - so you will have to look to yourself for any other explanation.

You said - Every single feast needed sacrifices for sin and needed the priesthood and temple. To say otherwise and try to do otherwise overturns exactly what you are saying is being done. There is no temple

I have no idea why you feel the need to say this - I have not suggested one needs to keep these feasts - and I hope u may feel that you can now stop suggesting this is the case. My comments you relate these points to are simply and explanation of how the feasts have been organised by God - and the wonder and marvel and ingenuity of His design.

But one should take note - that within the Millennium reign - SOME of the feasts will still operate and not all will be done away with. I think that maybe the lord in these days is seeking to prepare us for what lays ahead concerning our role and worship and reign.

If the church has not been darkened as you suggest - then I guess the church is really flowing in its whole glory - MANIFESTLY so!!!

The church is not without spot or blemish - a shadow has and does obscure its full light - even as we NOW only see through a glass darkly.

But there are times and seasons known to Him where he does manifest his light to a greater level . Where sin abounds - grace abounds EVEN more - and where that brings increasing darkness- so too will HE manifest His Light INCREASINGLY

This article is a message of hope, of encouragement - to show us that His patterns are not dead - but come to greater illuminations in the hours and days of his choosing - otherwise we faint - in our attempts to do good to do what is right - for if we faint not - we will reap a harvest.

It was for the harvest that is you and me thaT he PERSERVERED - it pulled Him through that we mat follow and be the first fruits.

So I hope that you may find yourself more able to receive this, than the tone of your response seems to suggest. And to keep in mind that the writing is not just designed to be read for yourself - but for the benefit of others.

Regarding the coins notation - Luk 15:5 And when he finds it, he joyfully puts it on his shoulders Luk 15:6 and goes home. Then he calls his friends and neighbors together and says, 'Rejoice with me; I have found my lost sheep.' Luk 15:7 I tell you that in the same way there will be more rejoicing in heaven over one sinner who repents than over ninety-nine righteous persons who do not need to repent. Luk 15:8 "Or suppose a woman has ten silver coins [fn] and loses one. Does she not light a lamp, sweep the house and search carefully until she finds it? Luk 15:9 And when she finds it, she calls her friends and neighbors together and says, 'Rejoice with me; I have found my lost coin.' Luk 15:10 In the same way, I tell you, there is rejoicing in the presence of the angels of God over one sinner who repents." Luk 15:9 And when she finds it, she calls her friends and neighbors together and says, 'Rejoice with me; I have found my lost coin. In the same way, I tell you, there is rejoicing in the presence of the angels of God over one sinner who repents."

The theme is REJOICE with me - it is about finding and saving the ONE who is lost - the 10 coins mentioned here - relates in fact to a wedding bracelet worn by the bride - 10 is the number of completeness - in other words the bride feels incomplete UNTIL she finds every last piece of it - mirrors the desire that father is not satisfied until the last one that is lost comes in.

But it is the joy and ardour that seeks to find. And in that process - the house is made clean.

In the same way - as the final days draw to its close - there is an increasing urgency that the full number are found - and the time of the of the Feasts of trumpets - also focus on a 10 day period of repentance whereby the kingdom is entered by those to seek to find it, Him

In these coming days - God will give His light in greater brilliance - like the opening of the aperture of a camera - this will draw the one and the many - back to the heart of the father and the father back to the heart of the children.

(07-27-2011 02:17 PM)chabod Wrote: [ -> ]No Vic - it is something written by myself - if it were another’s I would have made that plain - so not to take credit where none is due - and to honour those who write.

The article I refer to is generally information and perspective of the feast itself.

Thanks for the clarifying that chabod. I would appreciate that you don't post articles but merely dialogue.

Quote:I am not saying we should do this - but the feast is a type in itself - certain principles, themes and truths within it have their own focus on what is happening or to happen - it was not my intention to suggest one should copy - so you will have to look to yourself for any other explanation.

They are a type and shadow of what was to come in Christ. And they are fulfilled in HIm and many do not understand that concept.

Quote:I have no idea why you feel the need to say this - I have not suggested one needs to keep these feasts - and I hope u may feel that you can now stop suggesting this is the case. My comments you relate these points to are simply and explanation of how the feasts have been organised by God - and the wonder and marvel and ingenuity of His design.

The way you presented it suggested you were speaking of keeping them. THe feasts are done and fulfilled in Christ and those who continue to try to keep them and focus on them in general do so because of rejection of Christ's sacrifice--despite not keeping them according to the fulfilled law in the first place. We don't need to be focused on the timing, or the lunar versus other schedules, nor the concept that they are now for Today. It is Christ who lives and is for Today and who is calling all to Himself. It is to Him we are to turn. If one does not understand that, focusing on the feasts is not going to help.

Your focus on the '7 is the number of perfection, etc, is numerology and has nothing to do with living for or understanding Christ. Just as focusing on the lunar calender has nothing to do with serving Christ. Yes the types and shadows of the feasts and all Scripture are there for your learning.

Quote:But one should take note - that within the Millennium reign - SOME of the feasts will still operate and not all will be done away with. I think that maybe the lord in these days is seeking to prepare us for what lays ahead concerning our role and worship and reign.

If the church has not been darkened as you suggest - then I guess the church is really flowing in its whole glory - MANIFESTLY so!!!....

The Millenium issue is speculation. People get all set in saying this is exactly what will be. THe feasts are fulfilled in Christ. That's what needs to be understood Today. What happens when all is said and done, is fully God's business and what we think we might understand about those things is really speculative at best. Our Lord reigns and that is what the focus should be, not what we 'might' get out of it in the end. It should be enough to know the promise of being with Christ for eternity.

Jesus is the author and finisher of our faith and we are more than conquerors in Christ Jesus. He is building His church and it His Body. It is not darkened because we have been crucified with Him, and our sins are forgiven. We are reconciled to God because of Christ and are presented to Him unblamable, and cleansed in His sight because of Christ's righteousness alone. We are sanctified by His indwelling Spirit, and are complete in Him.

1Pe 1:23 Being born again, not of corruptible seed, but of incorruptible, by the word of God, which liveth and abideth for ever.

Eph 5:25 Husbands, love your wives, even as Christ also loved the church, and gave himself for it;
Eph 5:26 That he might sanctify and cleanse it with the washing of water by the word,
Eph 5:27 That he might present it to himself a glorious church, not having spot, or wrinkle, or any such thing; but that it should be holy and without blemish.

Quote:Regarding the coins notation - ...The theme is REJOICE with me - it is about finding and saving the ONE who is lost - the 10 coins mentioned here - relates in fact to a wedding bracelet worn by the bride - 10 is the number of completeness - in other words the bride feels incomplete UNTIL she finds every last piece of it - mirrors the desire that father is not satisfied until the last one that is lost comes in.

THe coin issue --it does not say it was a wedding bracelet worn by the bride.That is adding to the Scriptures to which we are forbidden to do. Numerology again regarding the number 10. YOu are not showing what version you are using but it is not the same as KJV. Please show version source.

Luk 15:8 Either what woman having ten pieces of silver, if she lose one piece, doth not light a candle, and sweep the house, and seek diligently till she find it?
Luk 15:9 And when she hath found it, she calleth her friends and her neighbours together, saying, Rejoice with me; for I have found the piece which I had lost.
Luk 15:10 Likewise, I say unto you, there is joy in the presence of the angels of God over one sinner that repenteth.

Yes the whole issue is about finding and saving that which is lost, because each matters to God, which is why there is great rejoicing over one sinner who repents. It is actually a presentation of the Gospel. HOwever, there is no indication whatsoever that this is pieces of silver from a wedding bracelet. IN fact the Greek word used for pieces of silver is drachme-

pieces of silver G1406
δραχμή
drachmē
Thayer Definition:
1) a drachma, a Greek silver coin about the same weight as a Roman denarius
Part of Speech: noun feminine
A Related Word by Thayer’s/Strong’s Number: from G1405

A "drachma" was the fourth part of a shekel, and of the same value with a Roman penny. It had nothing to do with a bracelet. We see the same phrase of 'pieces of silver' in this verse:

Mat 27:3 Then Judas, which had betrayed him, when he saw that he was condemned, repented himself, and brought again the thirty pieces of silver to the chief priests and elders,

pieces of silver:G694
ἀργύριον
argurion
Thayer Definition:
1) silver
2) money
3) a silver coin, silver piece, a shekel
Part of Speech: noun neuter
A Related Word by Thayer’s/Strong’s Number: neuter of a presumed

Quote:In these coming days - God will give His light in greater brilliance - like the opening of the aperture of a camera - this will draw the one and the many - back to the heart of the father and the father back to the heart of the children.

Jesus is the same yesterday, today and tomorrow. His light is the Light of the world. I see no Scriptures that suggest God is somehow going to be 'giving HIs light in greater brilliance'. If there is a Scripture for that, please provide it for us, otherwise that is merely your own ideas.