SeekGod.ca Discussion Forum - Erring on the side of caution

Okay, I am familiar with Peter's vision and Jesus telling people only to abstain from eating strangled animals, blood and presumably live animals, but I cannot bring myself to eat pork. There are a couple of dishes I would like to try, but I want to be certain that God doesn't care if I eat pork or not (he that doubteth is damned if he eats). I had to give up eating particular brands of delicious poultry sausage because I discovered they had a pork casing.

(12-16-2011 03:58 PM)YYZ Skinhead Wrote: [ -> ]Okay, I am familiar with Peter's vision and Jesus telling people only to abstain from eating strangled animals, blood and presumably live animals, but I cannot bring myself to eat pork. There are a couple of dishes I would like to try, but I want to be certain that God doesn't care if I eat pork or not (he that doubteth is damned if he eats). I had to give up eating particular brands of delicious poultry sausage because I discovered they had a pork casing.

Hey YYZ,

You can eat whatever you are comfortable or like eating,

Here's what God said through the NT Scriptures:

1Ti 4:1 Now the Spirit speaketh expressly, that in the latter times some shall depart from the faith, giving heed to seducing spirits, and doctrines of devils;
1Ti 4:2 Speaking lies in hypocrisy; having their conscience seared with a hot iron;
1Ti 4:3 Forbidding to marry, and commanding to abstain from meats, which God hath created to be received with thanksgiving of them which believe and know the truth.
1Ti 4:4 For every creature of God is good, and nothing to be refused, if it be received with thanksgiving:
1Ti 4:5 For it is sanctified by the word of God and prayer.
1Ti 4:6 If thou put the brethren in remembrance of these things, thou shalt be a good minister of Jesus Christ, nourished up in the words of faith and of good doctrine, whereunto thou hast attained.

Rom 14:1 Him that is weak in the faith receive ye, but not to doubtful disputations.
Rom 14:2 For one believeth that he may eat all things: another, who is weak, eateth herbs.
Rom 14:3 Let not him that eateth despise him that eateth not; and let not him which eateth not judge him that eateth: for God hath received him.
Rom 14:4 Who art thou that judgest another man's servant? to his own master he standeth or falleth. Yea, he shall be holden up: for God is able to make him stand.
Rom 14:5 One man esteemeth one day above another: another esteemeth every day alike. Let every man be fully persuaded in his own mind.
Rom 14:6 He that regardeth the day, regardeth it unto the Lord; and he that regardeth not the day, to the Lord he doth not regard it. He that eateth, eateth to the Lord, for he giveth God thanks; and he that eateth not, to the Lord he eateth not, and giveth God thanks.
Rom 14:7 For none of us liveth to himself, and no man dieth to himself.
Rom 14:8 For whether we live, we live unto the Lord; and whether we die, we die unto the Lord: whether we live therefore, or die, we are the Lord's.
Rom 14:9 For to this end Christ both died, and rose, and revived, that he might be Lord both of the dead and living.

Rom 14:14 I know, and am persuaded by the Lord Jesus, that there is nothing unclean of itself: but to him that esteemeth any thing to be unclean, to him it is unclean.
Rom 14:15 But if thy brother be grieved with thy meat, now walkest thou not charitably. Destroy not him with thy meat, for whom Christ died.
Rom 14:16 Let not then your good be evil spoken of:
Rom 14:17 For the kingdom of God is not meat and drink; but righteousness, and peace, and joy in the Holy Ghost.
Rom 14:18 For he that in these things serveth Christ is acceptable to God, and approved of men.

Act 15:20 But that we write unto them, that they abstain from pollutions of idols, and from fornication, and from things strangled, and from blood.

If you want to get into when things changed about the food, you can read the Peter's vision thread >http://www.seekgod.ca/forum/showthread.php?tid=37

So, you can freely eat what is available and this is different cultrually worldwide, but knowing there is nothing unclean for believers. However, if you know someone is offended if you serve them snails for example, you wouldn't do that, but in love would provide food you know they enjoy.

It's also like Paul wrote,

1Co 10:25 Whatsoever is sold in the shambles, that eat, asking no question for conscience sake:
1Co 10:26 For the earth is the Lord's, and the fulness thereof.
1Co 10:27 If any of them that believe not bid you to a feast, and ye be disposed to go; whatsoever is set before you, eat, asking no question for conscience sake.
1Co 10:28 But if any man say unto you, This is offered in sacrifice unto idols, eat not for his sake that shewed it, and for conscience sake: for the earth is the Lord's, and the fulness thereof:
1Co 10:29 Conscience, I say, not thine own, but of the other: for why is my liberty judged of another man's conscience?
1Co 10:30 For if I by grace be a partaker, why am I evil spoken of for that for which I give thanks?
1Co 10:31 Whether therefore ye eat, or drink, or whatsoever ye do, do all to the glory of God.

shambles >G3111
μάκελλον
makellon
mak'-el-lon
Of Latin origin [macellum]; a butcher's stall, meat market or provision shop: - shambles.

I personally don't care for seafood other than particular fish, I wouldn't eat grasshoppers, frogs, snakes or anything like that either but it's a matter of what one is used to; I don't care for pork particularly and don't normally buy it, but if served ham, or chops at someeone's home it's a non-issue. It's fine to eat it, and becomes a matter of choice and taste whether one enjoys it or not. Years ago we had some rancid pork roast given to us----it rather made a memory that stuck with me. Yuk

That's one I to this day if served somewhere, I can hardly bear. But you don't insult people, (who are sharing their food with you and you as their guest,) over food. 91c

Because pork is an issue for Jews and Muslims and because of the website, I don't normally eat it, simply so as not to be an offense over food. But that's something between me and God, and has nothing to do with being restricted from eating it or other things.

Hope that helps.

I remember the verse about vegetarians weak in faith but I forgot which verse it was. Getting handed rancid pork would kill anyone's taste for pig flesh. For me, knowing pigs'...uh, omnivorous dietary habits along with the Levitical prohibition did the same thing. I am glad that I can eat the chicken and sun-dried tomato sausage again. I just wanted to be certain that God had no objection to my eating it so I would no longer have doubts.

I've thought about this verse quit a bit..
Act 15:28 For it seemed good to the Holy Ghost, and to us, to lay upon you no greater burden than these necessary things;
Act 15:29 That ye abstain from meats offered to idols, and from blood, and from things strangled, and from fornication: from which if ye keep yourselves, ye shall do well. Fare ye well.

I think pretty much everything has been offered to an idol at some point in time..animals,herbs,vegetables.I wondered myself,what should we just not eat anything.I just thank God for it and eat trusting in Him.

I have also thought and this is only my speculation I haven't researched it and I have no scriptural proof to back this up but, it could be possible that when Paul wrote that it could have been a common practice for like the heathens to offer something to an idol like a chicken and then cook that very same chicken they had just sacrificed to an idol and eat it.
More presently chickens are sacrificed in voodoo rituals.Does that mean we shouldn't eat chicken?Or does it mean we shouldn't eat that chicken that was just used in the ritual?If you saw that chicken sacrificed to an idol then you can't eat it but if you don't know whether it was or not you thank God for it and eat...in my humble opinion. Biggrin

(12-17-2011 08:48 PM)Lois Wrote: [ -> ]I've thought about this verse quit a bit..
Act 15:28 For it seemed good to the Holy Ghost, and to us, to lay upon you no greater burden than these necessary things;
Act 15:29 That ye abstain from meats offered to idols, and from blood, and from things strangled, and from fornication: from which if ye keep yourselves, ye shall do well. Fare ye well.

I think pretty much everything has been offered to an idol at some point in time..animals,herbs,vegetables.I wondered myself,what should we just not eat anything.I just thank God for it and eat trusting in Him.

I have also thought and this is only my speculation I haven't researched it and I have no scriptural proof to back this up but, it could be possible that when Paul wrote that it could have been a common practice for like the heathens to offer something to an idol like a chicken and then cook that very same chicken they had just sacrificed to an idol and eat it.
More presently chickens are sacrificed in voodoo rituals.Does that mean we shouldn't eat chicken?Or does it mean we shouldn't eat that chicken that was just used in the ritual?If you saw that chicken sacrificed to an idol then you can't eat it but if you don't know whether it was or not you thank God for it and eat...in my humble opinion.

HI Lois,

Let's take a quick look at some Scriptures about all this.

1Co 8:1 Now as touching things offered unto idols, we know that we all have knowledge. Knowledge puffeth up, but charity edifieth.
1Co 8:2 And if any man think that he knoweth any thing, he knoweth nothing yet as he ought to know.
1Co 8:3 But if any man love God, the same is known of him.
1Co 8:4 As concerning therefore the eating of those things that are offered in sacrifice unto idols, we know that an idol is nothing in the world, and that there is none other God but one.
1Co 8:5 For though there be that are called gods, whether in heaven or in earth, (as there be gods many, and lords many,)
1Co 8:6 But to us there is but one God, the Father, of whom are all things, and we in him; and one Lord Jesus Christ, by whom are all things, and we by him.
1Co 8:7 Howbeit there is not in every man that knowledge: for some with conscience of the idol unto this hour eat it as a thing offered unto an idol; and their conscience being weak is defiled.
1Co 8:8 But meat commendeth us not to God: for neither, if we eat, are we the better; neither, if we eat not, are we the worse.
1Co 8:9 But take heed lest by any means this liberty of yours become a stumblingblock to them that are weak.
1Co 8:10 For if any man see thee which hast knowledge sit at meat in the idol's temple, shall not the conscience of him which is weak be emboldened to ***eat those things which are offered to idols; ***
1Co 8:11 And through thy knowledge shall the weak brother perish, for whom Christ died?
1Co 8:12 But when ye sin so against the brethren, and wound their weak conscience, ye sin against Christ.
1Co 8:13 Wherefore, if meat make my brother to offend, I will eat no flesh while the world standeth, lest I make my brother to offend.

sacrifice G2380
θύω
thuō
Thayer Definition:
1) to sacrifice, immolate
2) to slay, kill
2a) of the paschal lamb
3) slaughter

to devils G1140
δαιμόνιον
daimonion
Thayer Definition:
1) the divine power, deity, divinity
2) a spirit, a being inferior to God, superior to men
3) evil spirits or the messengers and ministers of the devil
Part of Speech: noun neuter

idol's temple G1493
εἰδωλεῖον
eidōleion
Thayer Definition:
1) an idol’s temple, temple consecrated to idols
Part of Speech: noun neuter

thing's which are offered to idols G1494
εἰδωλόθυτον
eidōlothuton
Thayer Definition:
1) sacrificed to idols, the flesh left over from the heathen sacrifices
1a) it was either eaten at the feasts or sold (by the poor and the miserly) in the market
Part of Speech: adjective

1Co 10:20 But I say, that the things which the Gentiles sacrifice, they sacrifice to devils, and not to God: and I would not that ye should have fellowship with devils.
1Co 10:21 Ye cannot drink the cup of the Lord, and the cup of devils: ye cannot be partakers of the Lord's table, and of the table of devils.
1Co 10:22 Do we provoke the Lord to jealousy? are we stronger than he?
1Co 10:23 All things are lawful for me, but all things are not expedient: all things are lawful for me, but all things edify not.
1Co 10:24 Let no man seek his own, but every man another's wealth.
1Co 10:25 Whatsoever is sold in the shambles, that eat, asking no question for conscience sake:
1Co 10:26 For the earth is the Lord's, and the fulness thereof.
1Co 10:27 *** If any of them that believe not bid you to a feast, and ye be disposed to go; whatsoever is set before you, eat, asking no question for conscience sake.
1Co 10:28 But if any man say unto you, This is offered in sacrifice unto idols, eat not for his sake that shewed it, and for conscience sake: for the earth is the Lord's, and the fulness thereof:
1Co 10:29 Conscience, I say, not thine own, but of the other: for why is my liberty judged of another man's conscience?
1Co 10:30 For if I by grace be a partaker, why am I evil spoken of for that for which I give thanks?
1Co 10:31 Whether therefore ye eat, or drink, or whatsoever ye do, do all to the glory of God.
1Co 10:32 Give none offence, neither to the Jews, nor to the Gentiles, nor to the church of God:
1Co 10:33 Even as I please all men in all things, not seeking mine own profit, but the profit of many, that they may be saved.

Ok from these 2 passages we see that:

> the Gentiles sacrificed in their temples; that sacrifice was to non existent gods; but to them they were real
> therefore those sacrifices were to devils or demons
> leftover food from those sacrifices were sold by the poor and needy in the markets
> believers were cautioned to not sit in the idols temples and eat those things which had been sacrificed to the idols
> believers were told they were to buy food in markets but not ask where the meat or food came from--that is, whether it was leftovers from the sacrifices to the idols in the temples; but rather just buy and eat it with no questions about it, for their and others conscience sake.

Paul believed all food came from and belonged to God and all could be partaken of--except under those circumstances...

1 Timothy 4:1-7 Now the Spirit speaketh expressly, that in the latter times some shall depart from the faith, giving heed to seducing spirits, and doctrines of devils; 2. Speaking lies in hypocrisy; having their conscience seared with a hot iron; 3. Forbidding to marry, and commanding to abstain from meats, which God hath created to be received with thanksgiving of them which believe and know the truth. 4. For every creature of God is good, and nothing to be refused, if it be received with thanksgiving: 5. For it is sanctified by the word of God and prayer. 6. If thou put the brethren in remembrance of these things, thou shalt be a good minister of Jesus Christ, nourished up in the words of faith and of good doctrine, whereunto thou hast attained. 7. But refuse profane and old wives' fables, and exercise thyself rather unto godliness.

Rom 14:11 For it is written, As I live, saith the Lord, every knee shall bow to me, and every tongue shall confess to God.
Rom 14:12 So then every one of us shall give account of himself to God.
Rom 14:13 Let us not therefore judge one another any more: but judge this rather, that no man put a stumblingblock or an occasion to fall in his brother's way.
Rom 14:14 I know, and am persuaded by the Lord Jesus, that there is nothing unclean of itself: but to him that esteemeth any thing to be unclean, to him it is unclean.
Rom 14:15 But if thy brother be grieved with thy meat, now walkest thou not charitably. Destroy not him with thy meat, for whom Christ died.
Rom 14:16 Let not then your good be evil spoken of:
Rom 14:17 For the kingdom of God is not meat and drink; but righteousness, and peace, and joy in the Holy Ghost.
Rom 14:18 For he that in these things serveth Christ is acceptable to God, and approved of men.

What do you think? Does this help?

Yes,thank you very much, Vic.That does give me a better understanding.