Christians and hate - Printable Version
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Christians and hate - YYZ Skinhead - 08-03-2010 09:26 PM
Jesus said "love thy neighbor" and "love thine enemies", and either He or Paul said that people claiming Belief cannot hate their brother. Does "brother" refer specifically to other Believers or to other humans in general?
Is a Christian forbidden to hate anyone, however evil that person/group may be?
Are Christians forbidden to promote and/or peddle hate propaganda and symbols? Fred "God Hates Everybody" Phelps of Westboro Baptist Church does this (though I dunno if he sells anything), and the Christian-Identity Ku Klux Klan of course claim Christianity and they most definitely profit off selling hate. Is a Christian who sells World War II memorabilia and Nazi paraphernalia sinning? There are many professing Christians who sell this kind of thing, so I wanted to get the facts.
RE: Christians and hate - sheep wrecked - 08-04-2010 12:40 PM
(08-03-2010 09:26 PM)YYZ Skinhead Wrote: Jesus said "love thy neighbor" and "love thine enemies", and either He or Paul said that people claiming Belief cannot hate their brother. Does "brother" refer specifically to other Believers or to other humans in general?
I think Jesus was referring to all mankind, just not brothers and sisters in Christ - because He said to love your enemy and do good to those who hate you.
Hatred for me, means that you dislike a person so much you wish they were dead. Jesus also said it you hate your brother in your heart, it's the same as committing murder. Dislike for a person is not that kind of hatred.
Jesus showed no hatred toward the Romans who beat and crucified Him and prayed that His Father would forgive them "because they know not what they do".
It's fine line between hate and dislike - the intent of the heart is everything. Hating the actions that the hate groups retaliate with are indeed hateful and evil, but we must always hope and pray for the individual's salvation. There is coming a day when we might be martyred for the Gospel by those who hate Christ. Stephen was a perfect example of this:
Act 7:55 But he, being full of the Holy Ghost, looked up stedfastly into heaven, and saw the glory of God, and Jesus standing on the right hand of God,
Act 7:56 And said, Behold, I see the heavens opened, and the Son of man standing on the right hand of God.
Act 7:57 Then they cried out with a loud voice, and stopped their ears, and ran upon him with one accord,
Act 7:58 And cast him out of the city, and stoned him: and the witnesses laid down their clothes at a young man's feet, whose name was Saul.
Act 7:59 And they stoned Stephen, calling upon God, and saying, Lord Jesus, receive my spirit.
Act 7:60 And he kneeled down, and cried with a loud voice, Lord, lay not this sin to their charge. And when he had said this, he fell asleep.
Selling WWII memorabilia is not a sin, although I would supposed the intent is the difference - nor would I think selling Nazi paraphernalia. It is not something that most Christians would do because it promotes the wickedness of an evil man. Sin is sin and those who are unbelievers and do things that we see as wicked are simply doing what comes "naturally" [carnal man]. It isn't going to make them more or more less sinful - they already are.
That's my two cents worth! Looking forward to what others have to say!
RE: Christians and hate - YYZ Skinhead - 08-04-2010 02:46 PM
Boy am I glad you posted this, because I CAN'T STAND most people (herd animals), but only to the point of disliking them because they are human, not caring if they die or not. (I care about vulnerable people, though. I love babies because they are innocent and too young to sin, and I pray for and donate to disabled and homeless people because I empathize with them.) I don't think I am better than anyone else, but I actively avoid most adults with whom I have nothing in common. But there are a lot of people who have done evil to me specifically or done evil in general, whom I wish would die! I probably need to ask God to make me no longer feel this way. At least I don't have to like them.
Thank you for including the hating your brother = murder quote because I had intended to include it, but overlooked it.
RE: Christians and hate - Rose of Shushan - 08-05-2010 09:25 AM
Quote:Jesus said "love thy neighbor" and "love thine enemies", and either He or Paul said that people claiming Belief cannot hate their brother. Does "brother" refer specifically to other Believers or to other humans in general?
Mat 5:43 Ye have heard that it hath been said, Thou shalt love thy neighbour, and hate thine enemy.
Mat 5:44 But I say unto you, Love your enemies, bless them that curse you, do good to them that hate you, and pray for them which despitefully use you, and persecute you;
Mat 5:45 That ye may be the children of your Father which is in heaven: for he maketh his sun to rise on the evil and on the good, and sendeth rain on the just and on the unjust.
Mat 5:46 For if ye love them which love you, what reward have ye? do not even the publicans the same?
Mat 5:47 And if ye salute your brethren only, what do ye more than others? do not even the publicans so?
Mat 5:48 Be ye therefore perfect, even as your Father which is in heaven is perfect.
There is also the parable of the good Samaritan that Jesus gave in response to your same question, ie who is my neighbour?
Luk 10:27 And he answering said, Thou shalt love the Lord thy God with all thy heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy strength, and with all thy mind; and thy neighbour as thyself.
Luk 10:28 And he said unto him, Thou hast answered right: this do, and thou shalt live.
Luk 10:29 But he, willing to justify himself, said unto Jesus, And who is my neighbour?
Luk 10:30 And Jesus answering said, A certain man went down from Jerusalem to Jericho, and fell among thieves, which stripped him of his raiment, and wounded him, and departed, leaving him half dead.
Luk 10:31 And by chance there came down a certain priest that way: and when he saw him, he passed by on the other side.
Luk 10:32 And likewise a Levite, when he was at the place, came and looked on him, and passed by on the other side.
Luk 10:33 But a certain Samaritan, as he journeyed, came where he was: and when he saw him, he had compassion on him,
Luk 10:34 And went to him, and bound up his wounds, pouring in oil and wine, and set him on his own beast, and brought him to an inn, and took care of him.
Luk 10:35 And on the morrow when he departed, he took out two pence, and gave them to the host, and said unto him, Take care of him; and whatsoever thou spendest more, when I come again, I will repay thee.
Luk 10:36 Which now of these three, thinkest thou, was neighbour unto him that fell among the thieves?
Luk 10:37 And he said, He that shewed mercy on him. Then said Jesus unto him, Go, and do thou likewise.
Quote:Is a Christian forbidden to hate anyone, however evil that person/group may be?
Since we are told so many times to love one another I do think that as Christians we shouldn't hate anyone. And if we do we should try to see why we are hating that person and deal with the emotions and thought processes that are leading to this hate.In most cases it will probably boil down to unforgiveness.
One parable of Jesus hits home really well for me when I am dealing with strong emotions against anyone.
Mat 18:23 Therefore is the kingdom of heaven likened unto a certain king, which would take account of his servants.
Mat 18:24 And when he had begun to reckon, one was brought unto him, which owed him ten thousand talents.
Mat 18:25 But forasmuch as he had not to pay, his lord commanded him to be sold, and his wife, and children, and all that he had, and payment to be made.
Mat 18:26 The servant therefore fell down, and worshipped him, saying, Lord, have patience with me, and I will pay thee all.
Mat 18:27 Then the lord of that servant was moved with compassion, and loosed him, and forgave him the debt.
Mat 18:28 But the same servant went out, and found one of his fellowservants, which owed him an hundred pence: and he laid hands on him, and took him by the throat, saying, Pay me that thou owest.
Mat 18:29 And his fellowservant fell down at his feet, and besought him, saying, Have patience with me, and I will pay thee all.
Mat 18:30 And he would not: but went and cast him into prison, till he should pay the debt.
Mat 18:31 So when his fellowservants saw what was done, they were very sorry, and came and told unto their lord all that was done.
Mat 18:32 Then his lord, after that he had called him, said unto him, O thou wicked servant, I forgave thee all that debt, because thou desiredst me:
Mat 18:33 Shouldest not thou also have had compassion on thy fellowservant, even as I had pity on thee?
Mat 18:34 And his lord was wroth, and delivered him to the tormentors, till he should pay all that was due unto him.
Mat 18:35 So likewise shall my heavenly Father do also unto you, if ye from your hearts forgive not every one his brother their trespasses.
Quote:Are Christians forbidden to promote and/or peddle hate propaganda and symbols? Fred "God Hates Everybody" Phelps of Westboro Baptist Church does this (though I dunno if he sells anything), and the Christian-Identity Ku Klux Klan of course claim Christianity and they most definitely profit off selling hate. Is a Christian who sells World War II memorabilia and Nazi paraphernalia sinning? There are many professing Christians who sell this kind of thing, so I wanted to get the facts.
I would say that we are definitely forbidden to promote or peddle any type of hate propaganda and things that go along with it such as literature, paraphernalia and memorabilia.
In the war memorabilia thing I would be hesitant to label that as sin but at the same time cannot view it as right either.War is not something to be glorified.Yet by attaching such value and importance to things associated with war it seems to be glorifying it and even deriving profit from it.
Sadly, YYZ, there are many who call themselves Christians and are involved in that kind of thing.
RE: Christians and hate - God's Lamb - 10-29-2011 01:22 AM
One can dislike intensely at times, but never hate. Hate always leads to evil. Hate causes wars. Hate brings separation from God. Because you can't love and hate at the same time. You must choose one or the other. Hate is like poisoning one self, what you mean for other (hateful feelings) only poisons yourself. Hate makes you bitter and sick, it will destroy the mind as well as the body. I know what I speak. At one time I hated my husbands parents because they were so cruel to him and his sister, that they were eventually raised by their grandparents. My husband was paralyzed emotionally by them. They abused me emotionally, and I told my husband when they abuse our children when we have them, I won't allow it, it stops with them. It did. I stood up to them and things got worse for me because of it. It took my husband a long time to "see" them for who they really were. Anyhoo, I ended up hating them and was deeply angry with my husband for not protecting us. But, how could he, he couldn't protect himself. So I went to the Lord. I asked the Lord to change my husband. He said, Okay, but first I'll start with YOU. I almost screamed out loud,"Me!" And the voice said in my mind, yes, you. So I said, Okay. I needed to "forgive" his parents and my husband. It took me a whole year to do that. I would say, I hate their guts (his parents), but help me to be willing to forgive them from the heart. And a year later on Easter, we went to their home. All that Hatred was gone. I could put my arms around them and give them a hug. Now, they did not change. But, that didn't make any difference to me. God had healed MY heart! There was now room to pray for them. I'd like to say that it turn out like "happy everafter" but it didn't. But, our emotions no longer ruled us! We were set free! So many times we "forgive" with the mind and tongue, but not the HEART. It is the heart that "transforms".....not the lips. We can't change people, we can only change ourselves with God's help. Over the years, things did get better between us and his parents, but it would never be truly loving family. But, praise God, my family adored my husband, and took him as one of their sons. My parents were the only parents he ever knew and loved and they adored him and loved him dearly. It is sad, when parents end up to be your "enemy" God never meant it to be that way. But, Satan is out to destroy the family and all of God's people. We are in a war, and we are Satan's enemy! What's sad, is that most of us don't know that the "real enemy" in life....is not people but Satan and his demons.
RE: Christians and hate - Vic - 10-29-2011 11:59 AM
Thank you for sharing that Marie. One thing I would add is that we cannot change ourselves. It is Christ who changes our hearts and minds. It's simply something that is beyond our own abilities because if we try to do it, we will fail. It can defintiely take time to work through our emotions and things of the flesh and allow Christ to shine through us. However, when we are given that desire to be obedient and have Christ given right attitudes we will indeed be changed. These Scriptures were some I got thinking of:
Rom 12:1 I beseech you therefore, brethren, by the mercies of God, that ye present your bodies a living sacrifice, holy, acceptable unto God, which is your reasonable service.
Rom 12:2 And be not conformed to this world: but be ye transformed by the renewing of your mind, that ye may prove what is that good, and acceptable, and perfect, will of God.
Tit 3:1 Put them in mind to be subject to principalities and powers, to obey magistrates, to be ready to every good work,
Tit 3:2 To speak evil of no man, to be no brawlers, but gentle, shewing all meekness unto all men.
Tit 3:3 For we ourselves also were sometimes foolish, disobedient, deceived, serving divers lusts and pleasures, living in malice and envy, hateful, and hating one another.
Tit 3:4 But after that the kindness and love of God our Saviour toward man appeared,
Tit 3:5 Not by works of righteousness which we have done, but according to his mercy he saved us, by the washing of regeneration, and renewing of the Holy Ghost;
Tit 3:6 Which he shed on us abundantly through Jesus Christ our Saviour;
Tit 3:7 That being justified by his grace, we should be made heirs according to the hope of eternal life.
Tit 3:8 This is a faithful saying, and these things I will that thou affirm constantly, that they which have believed in God might be careful to maintain good works. These things are good and profitable unto men.
Rom 8:5 For they that are after the flesh do mind the things of the flesh; but they that are after the Spirit the things of the Spirit.
Rom 8:6 For to be carnally minded is death; but to be spiritually minded is life and peace.
Rom 8:7 Because the carnal mind is enmity against God: for it is not subject to the law of God, neither indeed can be.
Rom 8:8 So then they that are in the flesh cannot please God.
Rom 8:9 But ye are not in the flesh, but in the Spirit, if so be that the Spirit of God dwell in you. Now if any man have not the Spirit of Christ, he is none of his.
Rom 8:10 And if Christ be in you, the body is dead because of sin; but the Spirit is life because of righteousness.
Rom 8:11 But if the Spirit of him that raised up Jesus from the dead dwell in you, he that raised up Christ from the dead shall also quicken your mortal bodies by his Spirit that dwelleth in you.
Rom 8:12 Therefore, brethren, we are debtors, not to the flesh, to live after the flesh.
Rom 8:13 For if ye live after the flesh, ye shall die: but if ye through the Spirit do mortify the deeds of the body, ye shall live.
Rom 8:14 For as many as are led by the Spirit of God, they are the sons of God.
Rom 8:26 Likewise the Spirit also helpeth our infirmities: for we know not what we should pray for as we ought: but the Spirit itself maketh intercession for us with groanings which cannot be uttered.
Rom 8:27 And he that searcheth the hearts knoweth what is the mind of the Spirit, because he maketh intercession for the saints according to the will of God.
Eph 4:21 If so be that ye have heard him, and have been taught by him, as the truth is in Jesus:
Eph 4:22 That ye put off concerning the former conversation the old man, which is corrupt according to the deceitful lusts;
Eph 4:23 And be renewed in the spirit of your mind;
Eph 4:24 And that ye put on the new man, which after God is created in righteousness and true holiness.
Eph 4:25 Wherefore putting away lying, speak every man truth with his neighbour: for we are members one of another.
Eph 4:26 Be ye angry, and sin not: let not the sun go down upon your wrath:
Eph 4:27 Neither give place to the devil.
Eph 4:28 Let him that stole steal no more: but rather let him labour, working with his hands the thing which is good, that he may have to give to him that needeth.
Eph 4:29 Let no corrupt communication proceed out of your mouth, but that which is good to the use of edifying, that it may minister grace unto the hearers.
Eph 4:30 And grieve not the holy Spirit of God, whereby ye are sealed unto the day of redemption.
Eph 4:31 Let all bitterness, and wrath, and anger, and clamour, and evil speaking, be put away from you, with all malice:
Eph 4:32 And be ye kind one to another, tenderhearted, forgiving one another, even as God for Christ's sake hath forgiven you.
Rom 1:4 And declared to be the Son of God with power, according to the spirit of holiness, by the resurrection from the dead:
Rom 1:5 By whom we have received grace and apostleship, for obedience to the faith among all nations, for his name:
Rom 1:6 Among whom are ye also the called of Jesus Christ:
2Co 10:3 For though we walk in the flesh, we do not war after the flesh:
2Co 10:4 (For the weapons of our warfare are not carnal, but mighty through God to the pulling down of strong holds;)
2Co 10:5 Casting down imaginations, and every high thing that exalteth itself against the knowledge of God, and bringing into captivity every thought to the obedience of Christ;
2Co 10:6 And having in a readiness to revenge all disobedience, when your obedience is fulfilled.
RE: Christians and hate - God's Lamb - 10-29-2011 05:02 PM
I think you missed a part of what I said....that is: we can only change " with God's help".
You are totally right we can not change ourselves. True change or transformation comes from the Lord, not ourselves!
Take Care and God Bless <><
RE: Christians and hate - Vic - 10-29-2011 05:24 PM
Actually didn't miss it. Just wanted to expand on it for the readers.
(10-29-2011 05:02 PM)Gods Lamb Wrote: I think you missed a part of what I said....that is: we can only change " with God's help".