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Eddie Chumney
07-04-2009, 06:16 PM (This post was last modified: 07-06-2009 02:01 PM by sheep wrecked.)
Post: #1
Eddie Chumney
mod note: Chumney's website is hebroots. I have disabled the hot link]

Start your discussion here.

Mat 10:34 "Do not think that I have come to bring peace to the earth. I have not come to bring peace, but a sword.
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07-05-2009, 06:02 PM (This post was last modified: 07-06-2009 03:02 PM by Vic.)
Post: #2
RE: Eddie Chumney
(07-04-2009 06:16 PM)grafted Wrote:  hebroots.org/
Start your discussion here.

Thanks I took a look at Chumney's site because I have some close friends in the Lord that mention his name, often.

Avi ben Mordechai is a Jewish believer in Yeshua as the Messiah and he is selling a Galations teaching series. He says, the book of Galatians is probably the most misunderstood and misinterpreted book in the New Testament. Why is this so? The main reason is that the book of Galatians has never been studied from a Torah-based First-Century Hebraic context. The Apostle Paul was originally a Pharasaic rabbinic Jew. In the book of Galatians, it is impossible to understand the writings of Paul without having an understanding of his Pharasaic rabbinic Judaism background."

I think this is an absolutely ridiculous statement, yet my friends probably agree with it. It sounds "scholarly", I guess. Th_ththink

Anyway, my friends say that they "just want to do whatever Jesus did. If it was good enough for Him then it is good enough for me."

They then go on to say that Jesus observed the Feasts, including Hanukkah, and that He observed the Sabbath.

Luk 9:58 And Jesus said unto him, Foxes have holes, and birds of the air have nests; but the Son of man hath not where to lay his head.

I don't see anyone giving up everything they own and sleeping under the stars. Walking everyday and preaching the Gospel. Sign0138

On the contrary, he is selling quite a bit of "studies." Money1
There is something disingenuous about all of this.

They don't really observe Passover or Sabbath or the Feasts the way a religious Jew would, so what is the point in all of this?

Thanks.

Jer 12:5 If thou hast run with the footmen, and they have wearied thee, then how canst thou contend with horses? and if in the land of peace, wherein thou trustedst, they wearied thee, then how wilt thou do in the swelling of Jordan?
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07-05-2009, 07:33 PM
Post: #3
RE: Eddie Chumney
Yes, St Paul was a Pharisee. and he was in error to be so, he is the frist to admit it. So do we study the truth of a man's writings in the light of earlier and repudiated error? Of course not
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07-05-2009, 10:04 PM
Post: #4
RE: Eddie Chumney
(07-05-2009 07:33 PM)Strefanash Wrote:  Yes, St Paul was a Pharisee. and he was in error to be so, he is the frist to admit it. So do we study the truth of a man's writings in the light of earlier and repudiated error? Of course not

Oh, I agree with you. I assure you I am not confused on this issue.

It is a strong spirit that bewitches men to fall from grace.

1Ti 4:1 Now the Spirit speaketh expressly, that in the latter times some shall depart from the faith, giving heed to seducing spirits, and doctrines of devils;

When you give heed to doctrines of devils you DEPART from the FAITH.

I also did not see hardly anything about the person of Jesus Christ on his website.

Gal 3:1 O foolish Galatians, who hath bewitched you, that ye should not obey the truth, before whose eyes Jesus Christ hath been evidently set forth, crucified among you?

Jesus Christ has been "evidently set forth before us."

Gal 5:5 For we through the Spirit wait for the hope of righteousness by faith.

Jer 12:5 If thou hast run with the footmen, and they have wearied thee, then how canst thou contend with horses? and if in the land of peace, wherein thou trustedst, they wearied thee, then how wilt thou do in the swelling of Jordan?
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07-05-2009, 10:32 PM (This post was last modified: 07-05-2009 10:36 PM by sheep wrecked.)
Post: #5
RE: Eddie Chumney
(07-05-2009 06:02 PM)heb13-13 Wrote:  Thanks I took a look at Chumney's site because I have some close friends in the Lord that mention his name, often.

Avi ben Mordechai is a Jewish believer in Yeshua as the Messiah and he is selling a Galations teaching series. He says, the book of Galatians is probably the most misunderstood and misinterpreted book in the New Testament. Why is this so? The main reason is that the book of Galatians has never been studied from a Torah-based First-Century Hebraic context. The Apostle Paul was originally a Pharasaic rabbinic Jew. In the book of Galatians, it is impossible to understand the writings of Paul without having an understanding of his Pharasaic rabbinic Judaism background."

I think this is an absolutely ridiculous statement, yet my friends probably agree with it. It sounds "scholarly", I guess. Th_ththink

Avi, the kabbalah king himself. And he denies the Deity of Christ. go figure ............ Swoon

Quote:Anyway, my friends say that they "just want to do whatever Jesus did. If it was good enough for Him then it is good enough for me."

They then go on to say that Jesus observed the Feasts, including Hanukkah, and that He observed the Sabbath.

Luk 9:58 And Jesus said unto him, Foxes have holes, and birds of the air have nests; but the Son of man hath not where to lay his head.

I don't see anyone giving up everything they own and sleeping under the stars. Walking everyday and preaching the Gospel. Sign0138

maybe they think they do that when they celebrate the feast of tabernacles - sleep out under the stars. well, except most of them either go to motels for a feast type conference complete with pool, a gym, and kosher food or tent camp. hard to quite focus on how this commemorates having been brought out of bondage (Egypt). but maybe they just have real good imaginations Smilies-34791

Quote:They don't really observe Passover or Sabbath or the Feasts the way a religious Jew would, so what is the point in all of this?

Thanks.

From what I have observed and even tried to myself when I was in messy was to keep the feasts like Judaism does. They have to because there is no other way to interpret the Law without Judaism in regard to the feasts. Without the sacrificial system, Jews and messys are dead in the water so to speak. In my opinion, the Talmud was developed to replace Torah because no one can keep Torah - either Jews or messys. All of it is based on the Aaronic/Levitical sacrificial system so the Talmud replaces Torah in authority giving the Jews a way to observe the feasts and the laws. Messy's just follow along with a Talmud interp. Many do not realize it of course. Or if they know it's Talmudic are not aware of it's denial of Christ. 2020a
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07-05-2009, 10:42 PM (This post was last modified: 07-05-2009 10:42 PM by sheep wrecked.)
Post: #6
RE: Eddie Chumney
(07-05-2009 10:04 PM)heb13-13 Wrote:  It is a strong spirit that bewitches men to fall from grace.

1Ti 4:1 Now the Spirit speaketh expressly, that in the latter times some shall depart from the faith, giving heed to seducing spirits, and doctrines of devils;

When you give heed to doctrines of devils you DEPART from the FAITH.

I also did not see hardly anything about the person of Jesus Christ on his website.

Gal 3:1 O foolish Galatians, who hath bewitched you, that ye should not obey the truth, before whose eyes Jesus Christ hath been evidently set forth, crucified among you?

Jesus Christ has been "evidently set forth before us."

Gal 5:5 For we through the Spirit wait for the hope of righteousness by faith.

You are right on the mark. Messianicism elevates Torah above Christ. He takes second place. Or they try to force that Jesus IS Torah and therefore, when they eulogize Torah, they are worshiping Christ. It's pretty sad any way you look at it. Sos Gaah
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07-05-2009, 10:51 PM
Post: #7
RE: Eddie Chumney
(07-05-2009 10:42 PM)sheep wrecked Wrote:  
(07-05-2009 10:04 PM)heb13-13 Wrote:  It is a strong spirit that bewitches men to fall from grace.

1Ti 4:1 Now the Spirit speaketh expressly, that in the latter times some shall depart from the faith, giving heed to seducing spirits, and doctrines of devils;

When you give heed to doctrines of devils you DEPART from the FAITH.

I also did not see hardly anything about the person of Jesus Christ on his website.

Gal 3:1 O foolish Galatians, who hath bewitched you, that ye should not obey the truth, before whose eyes Jesus Christ hath been evidently set forth, crucified among you?

Jesus Christ has been "evidently set forth before us."

Gal 5:5 For we through the Spirit wait for the hope of righteousness by faith.

You are right on the mark. Messianicism elevates Torah above Christ. He takes second place. Or they try to force that Jesus IS Torah and therefore, when they eulogize Torah, they are worshiping Christ. It's pretty sad any way you look at it. Sos Gaah

Sheep Wrecked, Thanks!!16679

Your replies are very informative. Humorous, too. They give me some ideas and info for my friends.

So, it is the Talmud that they have to revert to because they cannot keep true Torah? 6820

Jer 12:5 If thou hast run with the footmen, and they have wearied thee, then how canst thou contend with horses? and if in the land of peace, wherein thou trustedst, they wearied thee, then how wilt thou do in the swelling of Jordan?
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07-05-2009, 11:26 PM
Post: #8
RE: Eddie Chumney
(07-05-2009 10:51 PM)heb13-13 Wrote:  So, it is the Talmud that they have to revert to because they cannot keep true Torah? 6820

Yes, exactly. Although many Messicanics do not know that what they believe is actually Talmudic. The leaders/teachers are very good at hiding this. They tout their understanding as "special revelation" or what the "ancient sages" knew. As if this makes it OK to rewrite Scripture Sign0082

Glad to be of help Th_airplane but for the grace of God I would still be caught up in into that whole mess - pun intended 15357
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07-06-2009, 02:24 PM (This post was last modified: 07-06-2009 02:31 PM by sheep wrecked.)
Post: #9
RE: Eddie Chumney
Eddie Chumney received his "Hebraic understanding" by way of some training from an Orthodox Jew. That has pretty much "colored" his presentation of Hebrew Roots. His website is full of links to everything Rabbinical, Talmudic, and kabbalistic.

Chumney got his start through MIA [Messianic Israel Alliance] and is still loosely affiliated with them. He speaks at some of their conferences. This is how he got his start into teaching "Two House" or Ephramite theology.

Two House is a rather complicated doctrine that permeates Hebrew Roots. It seems to be getting more popular. The premise is based on Ezekiel 37:18. I included the passage, because I believe it is important to note that it is obvious this was fulfilled under the New Covenant in Jesus Christ [verses 21-28] - Jesus joined the two houses when He was sacrificed. we know this because Eph 2 speaks of one new man in Christ. Also Paul pointed to the fact that there is no more Jew or gentile in Christ - this is the mystery of the Gospel.


Eze 37:19 Say unto them, Thus saith the Lord GOD; Behold, I will take the stick of Joseph, which is in the hand of Ephraim, and the tribes of Israel his fellows, and will put them with him, even with the stick of Judah, and make them one stick, and they shall be one in mine hand.
Eze 37:20 And the sticks whereon thou writest shall be in thine hand before their eyes.

Eze 37:21 And say unto them, Thus saith the Lord GOD; Behold, I will take the children of Israel from among the heathen, whither they be gone, and will gather them on every side, and bring them into their own land:
Eze 37:22 And I will make them one nation in the land upon the mountains of Israel; and one king shall be king to them all: and they shall be no more two nations, neither shall they be divided into two kingdoms any more at all:
Eze 37:23 Neither shall they defile themselves any more with their idols, nor with their detestable things, nor with any of their transgressions: but I will save them out of all their dwellingplaces, wherein they have sinned, and will cleanse them: so shall they be my people, and I will be their God.
Eze 37:24 And David my servant shall be king over them; and they all shall have one shepherd: they shall also walk in my judgments, and observe my statutes, and do them.
Eze 37:25 And they shall dwell in the land that I have given unto Jacob my servant, wherein your fathers have dwelt; and they shall dwell therein, even they, and their children, and their children's children for ever: and my servant David shall be their prince for ever.
Eze 37:26 Moreover I will make a covenant of peace with them; it shall be an everlasting covenant with them: and I will place them, and multiply them, and will set my sanctuary in the midst of them for evermore.
Eze 37:27 My tabernacle also shall be with them: yea, I will be their God, and they shall be my people.
Eze 37:28 And the heathen shall know that I the LORD do sanctify Israel, when my sanctuary shall be in the midst of them for evermore.


What Two House maintains is that the House of Judah [the Jewish people or national Israel] will one day come together with the House of Israel [which is really the 10 tribes all in one called Ephraim and are "lost"]. Those who come to follow Torah are really bloodline Jews or Ephramites and therefore have a right to property in the land of Israel. In other words, the inheritance is also theirs.

In order for Christ to return, the House of Judah and the House of Israel must be joined together as brothers, fulfilling Ez. Jesus cannot return until this is accomplished. Ephramites are convinced that if they keep the law that the House of Judah will become jealous and then accept them as part of themselves. There is a ton wrong with this picture of course, and as time allows we can delve into that in the Two House thread. I don't want to derail this one. Only to show his particular involvement, which is heavy.

Most HR Two Housers look to Chumney and MIA [Angus and Batya Wooten] as the heads of this movement. Marshall Koniuchowsky of YATI [Your Arms to Israel - Talmudist, kabbalist, and polygamist] is also a break off of MIA, although it was not friendly. Another unfriendly break off from MIA was Mark Huey and his stepson John McKee who have their own websites. They are also Two House and are pushing Talmud.

Some of Chumney's more perverse teachings include that the bride of Christ will replace satan's place as the bride of "yahweh". Pretty trashy stuff. This is alluded to in one of his books.
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07-06-2009, 08:51 PM
Post: #10
RE: Eddie Chumney
That reminds me of the following.
Rev 2:9 "'I know your tribulation and your poverty (but you are rich) and the slander of those who say that they are Jews and are not, but are a synagogue of Satan.

Mat 10:34 "Do not think that I have come to bring peace to the earth. I have not come to bring peace, but a sword.
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