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carl37 · 12-24-2008, 11:03 PM

Dear Sheep Wrecked,

Thank you for your kindness. I in no way am saying that we need to observe the feasts to be saved. Belief in the Messiah (Yahshua) or (Yeshua) as some would say, is the only way of salvation. Did not the Almighty say in Deuteronomy 4:40 that his commandments and statutes were to be observed forever? If they were going to be abolished with the crucifixion then wouldn't he have said they were to be observed for a "season"? One could make the argument that he was giving the instructions to the Jewish people. But aren't we grafted in when we accept the messiah? It seems strange that there seems to be a set of rules and regulations for the people in the pre New Testament days and afterwards a different set. Also why did Yahshua observe the feasts? He knew that he had to fulfill his father's will. If the observance of the Sabbath or the feasts was insignificant then why didn't he just say so? It seems that the feasts and the sabbath and such are as paul says "a shadow of things to come" How would one know where he was going or what was coming if he had never been there or seen what was coming? The slaying of the passover lamb was a shadow picture of the Messiah being slain, the waving of the sheaves of the first fruits of the grain harvest at Pentecost was a picture of the Messiah being the first fruit of the resurrection of the dead along with those saints mentioned in Matthew 27: 52-53. Remember when Mary went to touch him in the garden after the resurrection? Why did he step back and tell her that he hadn't yet ascended to his father. Wasn't the Ascenscion 40 days later? Then why did he that same evening tell Thomas to touch him? Because it would seem that he ascended along with those saints to present the firstfruits of the resurrection to everlasting life to the Almighty. The feasts are a reminder of what is to come. The fall feasts haven't been completed. If we aren't observing them then how are we to know and understand what is coming? Also look at the shadow pictures of other events. In exodus 32 about 3000 died for disobeying god. In Acts 2:41 there were about 3000 saved. I'm sure there are others, but the point is that what the Almighty established years ago does not change or become discarded. It really is marvelous that the Almighty established the shadow pictures in the Torah and that we get a chance to live them out now. You are right. It really is simple. When Yahshua died and said it was finished I believe he meant the need for the sacrifices and works. Because if everything was finished he would have already come back and established his kingdom. While in essence he has established his kingdom by his death, burial and resurrection we know that Revelation hasn't come to pass therefore everything isn't totally finished. As far as the names. I am not a scholar by any means. I do know that hebrew names have a meaning. Jesus is not hebrew and has no hebrew meaning. Yahshua to my knowledge means "God or Almighty saves". It would seem that names pretty much translate similarly between languages. Example: Carl in English translates to Carlos in Spanish. Michael in English translates to Mikhail in Russian. Jesus in no way translates to Yahshua in hebrew. But I would like to know what the Almighty's name is. We are told in church that if we call upon the name of the lord we would be saved. Well what is the name of the Lord. As I said in my earlier posts. I in no way want or intend to offend anyone. I can in no way guarantee that I have a lock on exactly how the scriptures should be interpreted. I can guarantee that when the almighty returns he will separate the wheat from the chaff! Thank you very much for this opportunity and discussion.

Rose of Shushan · 12-24-2008, 11:09 PM

Hi strefanash

great posts there Smiles_pinkbounce

Is this the verse you want ?

Rom 14:5 One man esteems one day above another: another esteems every day alike. Let every man be fully persuaded in his own mind.
Rom 14:6 He that regards the day, regards it unto the Lord; and he that regards not the day, to the Lord he does not regard it. He that eats, eats to the Lord, for he gives God thanks; and he that eats not, to the Lord he eats not, and gives God thanks.
Rom 14:7 For none of us lives to himself, and no man dies to himself.
Rom 14:8 For whether we live, we live unto the Lord; and whether we die, we die unto the Lord: whether we live therefore, or die, we are the Lord's.
Rom 14:9 For to this end Christ both died, and rose, and revived, that he might be Lord both of the dead and living.
Rom 14:10 But why do you judge your brother? or why do you despise your brother? for we shall all stand before the judgment seat of Christ.

and Happy Christmas

carl37 · 12-24-2008, 11:26 PM

Strefanash,

I agree that the Torah (which is what the Law is) points out the fact that we are "dead" however, it also shows us how to have a successful life. For instance if one commits adultery and fornication then it is possible or likely one will get a disease. If you follow the command to not commit adultery or to engage in fornication, it's a pretty safe bet you won't catch a sexually transmitted disease. To me that is quite successful in this day and age. That is just one example. Also, regarding Paul, I admit he is fascinating and I will want to meet him. However, I do not put much emphasis on what he wrote. I would like to think we should look at what Yahshua taught and what he was teaching out of as a point of emphasis. As far as one doing what is satisfying in ones own mind, that is tough to swallow, because before I accepted the saviour and even the millions who have yet to accept him, we were all doing what we were satisfied with or comfortable with in our own mind.
Thank you for the interesting conversation!!

Rose of Shushan · 12-25-2008, 01:57 PM

Quote:Did not the Almighty say in Deuteronomy 4:40 that his commandments and statutes were to be observed forever?

Carl I see where it says they are to be observed as part of a Covenant, one which ended up broken by the people themselves

Deu 4:1 Now therefore hearken, O Israel, unto the statutes and unto the judgments, which I teach you, to do them, that you may live, and go in and possess the land which the LORD God of your fathers gives you.
Deu 4:2 You shall not add unto the word which I command you, neither shall you take away from it, that you may keep the commandments of the LORD your God which I command you.

If Jesus comes as a mere prophet taking people back to Torah of Moses why is the temple destroyed in judgement and the people scattered?

Quote:If they were going to be abolished with the crucifixion then wouldn't he have said they were to be observed for a "season"?

Yes. That is why the prophets Jeremiah, Ezekiel and Deut 30 both speak of a new covenant. God knew that the mosaic they would break. The NT speaks more detail of this in Ephesians, Colossians and book of Hebrews among others.

Quote:One could make the argument that he was giving the instructions to the Jewish people. But aren't we grafted in when we accept the messiah? It seems strange that there seems to be a set of rules and regulations for the people in the pre New Testament days and afterwards a different set.

Why strange? It is a new Covenant with better promises and different conditions.

Heb 8:6 But now has he obtained a more excellent ministry, by how much also he is the mediator of a better covenant, which was established upon better promises.

We are not grafted into the first covenant Carl.
Have you seen the couple of threads that deal in the differences between the covenants?I don’t want derail to original topic by reiterating things here that I've written on in more detail elsewhere on here recently. Take a look and see what you make of the verses and explanations offered therein.

Quote:Also why did Yahshua observe the feasts? He knew that he had to fulfill his father's will. If the observance of the Sabbath or the feasts was insignificant then why didn't he just say so?

He did observe the Fathers will and abide by all the conditions of the first covenant but that’s because he came under the first covenant. It wasn’t that the observance or feasts were insignificant but the gospels are full of Jesus, explaining how adherence to the outward principles of the law are useless if our hearts are not being circumcised. The prophets were admonishing the people for the same thing for quite a few hundred years and had it worked?
Was Jesus just another prophet? No! God had had enough. Israel had had judges, prophets ,kings and priests all in charge of the nation and each having dominance at particular times and the result was always the same. So Jesus came away to do away with the first covenant, since they broke it and inaugurated the new one by his death.
A New Covenant ,meant that the people were no longer bound to the old one and therefore like Paul said, no longer under the law.

Quote:It seems that the feasts and the sabbath and such are as paul says "a shadow of things to come"

Yes and the reality was Messiah Jesus and the New Covenant he would inaugurate for the remission of sins. The blood of animals and goats would never take away sin but merely pointed to the one that one day would, once and for all.

Quote: The feasts are a reminder of what is to come. The fall feasts haven't been completed.

The feasts and the ceremonial ordinances included in the Torah ,pointed to Messiah ,how he would accomplish Gods salvation plan. Paul said the Law was our schoolmaster and tutor and rightly so, it is full of things which teach us .Bear one thing in mind though. Jesus and the disciples saw the whole Pentateuch, psalms and prophets as the LAW. They do not pass, or are done away with as instruction and revelation of Gods will, character, standards etc but we are not under the commands and ordinances given to Israel when they came out of Egypt ,as the formed part of the first covenant. We are under the New Covenant which was foretold in the LAW(think whole 5 books, prophets and psalms here).
The fall feasts have been accomplished in Jesus

Luk 24:25 Then he said unto them, O foolish ones, and slow of heart to believe all that the prophets have spoken:
Luk 24:26 Ought not Christ to have suffered these things, and to enter into his glory?
Luk 24:27 And beginning at Moses and all the prophets, he expounded unto them in all the scriptures the things concerning himself.

Luk 24:44 And he said unto them, These are the words which I spoke unto you, while I was yet with you, that all things must be fulfilled, which were written in the law of Moses, and in the prophets, and in the psalms, concerning me.
Luk 24:45 Then opened he their understanding, that they might understand the scriptures,
Luk 24:46 And said unto them, Thus it is written, and thus it was fit for Christ to suffer, and to rise from the dead the third day:
Luk 24:47 And that repentance and remission of sins should be preached in his name among all nations, beginning at Jerusalem.
Luk 24:48 And you are witnesses of these things.

Quote: If we aren't observing them then how are we to know and understand what is coming?

We don’t have to perform the actual rituals, slaying of animals , etc in order to see and learn from the concepts etc. And we don’t observe them anyway Carl in their entirety. Do you tithe to a cohen, in grain?
Do you bring sacrifices to the Temple, put to death your kids if they're persistently disobedient, stone adulterous women , ect etc? I know you don’t, that is not what the NT taught is it?
When faced with the adulterous woman in John 8 do we see where he affirmed Moses by saying that she should be stoned? The woman was clearly guilty.

Joh 8:4 They said unto him, Teacher, this woman was taken in adultery, in the very act.

The Law of Moses called for death , there's no way around it. Yet Jesus used the chance to show that before judging others according to the law, lets all look at our own hearts .He then said to the woman that she was under no condemnation. Hmm..according to the Law of Moses she was under condemnation yet Jesus didn’t so was he endorsing the torah of Moses there?

12-25-2008, 02:33 PM

(12-24-2008 11:26 PM)carl37 Wrote: Strefanash,

If you follow the command to not commit adultery or to engage in fornication, it's a pretty safe bet you won't catch a sexually transmitted disease. To me that is quite successful in this day and age. That is just one example.

But this only addresses externals. For sure if we refrain from the act we wont get STD's, but Jesus himself said that if we look with lust at a woman, we have already committed adultery. And the fact is that if we have the impulse it is too late we have already sinned.

That impulse is not temptation, fighting it does no good

The inner nature of sin refutes what you are saying. It is too late I am in over my head as regards sin.

I am moving to reject legalism not by claiming that the Law does not apply to us, but by the simple knowldge that NONE of our efforts ever constituted obedience to it.

The Law said love your neighbour. But all we can do is force down our hostile impulses towards him and force ourselves to do good deeds to him. But such was NEVER commanded in the Law. Our effort is hypocrisy, we actually skirt the central issue of the Law because we never acknowlege that we do not have the love that the LaW talks about.

It is a matter of biblical logic that our efforts are completely wasted. all we are doing is whitening the sepulchre. THis is because the impulse we fight against is the dead man's bones within that are festering.

Contrary to our sanguine self image, our moral effort does not show us to be good, rather the evil impulse in us that we fight shows us to be evil

Legalism IS the sin it fight. That is to say if we force ourselves to look away from someone we lust after, we are still lusting after them, so looking away does not one ounce of good as regards the disposition of our heart. It in fact makes it worse. That is what i mean by the fact that our effort does not address the issue, and actually skirts it. Indeed only a lustful person needs to force himself to look away from a beautiful woman or such.

I am afraid that if you "de emphasize St Paul" I think you are on perilous ground, but you will note that I have not referred to him in this post.

I have tried harder than most over 30 years to obey the moral law. I am FAR worse a person than i was in my youth for doing this. And how hard did I try? to the point of nervous breakdown and madness. It darkened my mind and distorted my view of God and even now I am needing to be brought to repent of seeing him as a monster. and why? if i look at the Law consistently, as opposed to the typical shallow nod of passing attention that most relgious people look at it with, I am in constant tension and completely strait jacketed. And this has been my portion for 30 years, or even more as I was a legalist prig while i was a child (I am 50 now, was converted a few weeks before my 20th birthday. Trying to keep the law has devastated my life and destroyed my youth

(12-24-2008 11:09 PM)Rose of Shushan Wrote: Hi strefanash

great posts there

Is this the verse you want ?

Rom 14:5 One man esteems one day above another: another esteems every day alike. Let every man be fully persuaded in his own mind.
Rom 14:6 He that regards the day, regards it unto the Lord; and he that regards not the day, to the Lord he does not regard it. He that eats, eats to the Lord, for he gives God thanks; and he that eats not, to the Lord he eats not, and gives God thanks.
Rom 14:7 For none of us lives to himself, and no man dies to himself.
Rom 14:8 For whether we live, we live unto the Lord; and whether we die, we die unto the Lord: whether we live therefore, or die, we are the Lord's.
Rom 14:9 For to this end Christ both died, and rose, and revived, that he might be Lord both of the dead and living.
Rom 14:10 But why do you judge your brother? or why do you despise your brother? for we shall all stand before the judgment seat of Christ.

and Happy Christmas

YES. that's the passage. Thanks

sheep wrecked · (This post was last modified: 12-25-2008 05:29 PM by sheep wrecked.)

(12-24-2008 11:26 PM)carl37 Wrote: Also, regarding Paul, I admit he is fascinating and I will want to meet him. However, I do not put much emphasis on what he wrote. I would like to think we should look at what Yahshua taught and what he was teaching out of as a point of emphasis.

Just a friendly reminder - we try to keep the threads on topic - so I would invite all to go to this thread to discuss Paul and his writings 6799

Messianic Judaism Forum - Hebrew Roots - Why Should We Listen to Paul?

http://www.seekgod.ca/forum/showthread.php?tid=60

ALL posts relating to keeping the Law - please post here:

Messianic Judasim - Hebrew Roots - Are We Commanded to Keep the Mosaic Law [Torah]?

http://www.seekgod.ca/forum/showthread.php?tid=61

7143

sheep wrecked · (This post was last modified: 12-25-2008 03:37 PM by sheep wrecked.)

I moved this post over to Messianic Judaism - Are We Commanded to Keep the Mosaic Law [Torah]? Please answer over there 7143

http://www.seekgod.ca/forum/showthread.php?tid=61

Quote: Quote:Did not the Almighty say in Deuteronomy 4:40 that his commandments and statutes were to be observed forever?

Strefanash: well, yes. But do our efforts equal obedience to these? No.

Put it this way. In Isaiah 1 God says he is sick to death of the noise of their religious activity He askes in verse 12 "Who commanded of you this trampling of my courts?"

Well, you could say that HE DID. It is all in Moses. So what was God complaining about? As with typically religious people of all the ages they were there out of duty, and the mere fact of their dutifulness makes a mockery of what the Lord actually meant by the commandment. They necessarily, (given the nature of sin) were doing only the externals, and so totally missed the point.

And so have I, I begin to see after decades of fruitless struggle. But am i the only one in the church with this problem?

In doing the externals they, the people Isaiah spoke to, were still not obeying the commandment, and indeed their commitment to obey the commandment could ONLY produce externals. That is why as Jesus said the will of the flesh profits nothing.

He also said that if we were to enter the Kingdom that our righteousness would have to exceed that of the Pharisees. But of our efforts this can never happen for the Pharisees were the most determined of men. Our determination will not have us exceed the pharisees in righteousness, it will only have us equal them in sin. After all the prophet said there is none righteous

WE have NEVER obeyed the Law for our careless words (you know the passage?), being that by which we are judged, give the game away, for they show we never loved our neighbour therefore we never loved God.

And as the greatest commandment is to Love God but we never have, condemnation can only be the only result of our efforts and hypocrisy the very nature of our efforts.

The Law is good in what it commands, but not in what it produces

carl37 · 12-25-2008, 07:05 PM

I myself tend to believe when the Almighty says forever it means forever. The fall feasts are not completed. When the scriptures say of his return that no man knows the day or hour, it is clearly a reference to the Feast of Trumpets. All other feasts are on the full moon, 14 days after the last new moon. Those can be counted. The Feast of Trumpets is on the new moon which signaled the first day of the month. Two witnesses were needed to testify to the Sanhedrin that they indeed saw the new moon. Fires would then be lit to let the Jewish people throughout the land know that the feast had begun. Hence the uncertainty of the day and the hour. You could not just count the days. You had to watch for the moon. Now for the easy part. The Feast of Trumpets is the only feast where the trumpet is blown. It is blown 100 times. The 100th trump is known as the last trump. Therefore when Paul is talking of "The Rapture" in 1 Corinthians "we shall not all sleep but we shall be changed in the twinkling of an eye at the Last Trump". That is the shadow picture fulfillment of the Feast of Trumpets. We have seen that the messiah fulfilled the passover. He was the spotless lamb. The slaying of the lamb was a shadow picture of the messiah becoming the final sacrifice. We also see that when he arose and told Mary that he had to ascend to his father, he was presenting himself as the firstfruits harvest. Again a shadow picture of waiving the sheaves of wheat as a firstfruit offering. Why then would the shadow pictures stop? They don't. When the messiah returns it will be at the Feast of Trumpets. Again fulfilling the shadow picture of watching. This time instead of just watching for the sighting of the new moon, but also watching for his return so that we are not caught off guard.

Rose of Shushan · 12-25-2008, 08:49 PM

Quote:I myself tend to believe when the Almighty says forever it means forever. The fall feasts are not completed. When the scriptures say of his return that no man knows the day or hour, it is clearly a reference to the Feast of Trumpets. All other feasts are on the full moon, 14 days after the last new moon.
Those can be counted. The Feast of Trumpets is on the new moon which signaled the first day of the month. Two witnesses were needed to testify to the Sanhedrin that they indeed saw the new moon. Fires would then be lit to let the Jewish people throughout the land know that the feast had begun. Hence the uncertainty of the day and the hour. You could not just count the days. You had to watch for the moon.

The feast of Rosh Chodesh,ie the first day of the month, is also on a day that noone knows according to your definition, so is it pointing Messiahs return every month also? I had heard the above explanation you just gave in messianic circles but it always confused me as reading into those statements the return of Messiah seems to be purely conjecture. Like I said already, the feast of the New Moon also came on the first day of the month.

Quote: Now for the easy part. The Feast of Trumpets is the only feast where the trumpet is blown. It is blown 100 times. The 100th trump is known as the last trump. Therefore when Paul is talking of "The Rapture" in 1 Corinthians "we shall not all sleep but we shall be changed in the twinkling of an eye at the Last Trump". That is the shadow picture fulfillment of the Feast of Trumpets.

The blowing of the trumpet 100 times on yom teruah is rabbinic btw and according to jewish tradition they are symbolic of the one hundred and one letters contained in the lament of Sisera's mother as she awaited her son's return from the battlefield as recorded in the Song of Devorah .

As to where you said that the 100 th trump is known as the last trump obviously the last blast is the last one. But ,seriously, what does a rabbinic tradition have to do with Messiahs return? -I don’t see how we can tie this to Messiahs return based on those statements.
.

1Th 4:16 For the Lord himself shall descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of the archangel, and with the trump of God: and the dead in Christ shall rise first:

1Co 15:52 In a moment, in the twinkling of an eye, at the last trump: for the trumpet shall sound, and the dead shall be raised incorruptible, and we shall be changed.

[color=#4682B4]There are many verses to do with trumpets in the OT .Trumpets were sounded for various reasons. There are many but hes a couple
[/color]

Exo 19:16 And it came to pass on the third day in the morning, that there were thunders and lightnings, and a thick cloud upon the mount, and the voice of the trumpet exceedingly loud; so that all the people that were in the camp trembled.
Lev 25:9 Then shall you cause the trumpet of the jubilee to sound on the tenth day of the seventh month, on the day of atonement shall you make the trumpet sound throughout all your land.

Jos 6:5 And it shall come to pass, that when they make a long blast with the ram's horn, and when you hear the sound of the trumpet, all the people shall shout with a great shout; and the wall of the city shall fall down flat, and the people shall ascend up every man straight before him.

1Ki 1:39 And Zadok the priest took a horn of oil out of the tabernacle, and anointed Solomon. And they blew the trumpet; and all the people said, God save king Solomon.

I cannot conclude based on those two verses in NT that the feast of trumpets wasn’t fulfilled because of them
I will start a thread during the next few days on how the feasts were fulfilled so as to not derail this one.

sheep wrecked · (This post was last modified: 04-07-2013 12:47 PM by Vic.)

(12-25-2008 07:05 PM)carl37 Wrote: I myself tend to believe when the Almighty says forever it means forever. The fall feasts are not completed. When the scriptures say of his return that no man knows the day or hour, it is clearly a reference to the Feast of Trumpets. All other feasts are on the full moon, 14 days after the last new moon. Those can be counted. The Feast of Trumpets is on the new moon which signaled the first day of the month. Two witnesses were needed to testify to the Sanhedrin that they indeed saw the new moon. Fires would then be lit to let the Jewish people throughout the land know that the feast had begun. Hence the uncertainty of the day and the hour. You could not just count the days. You had to watch for the moon. Now for the easy part. The Feast of Trumpets is the only feast where the trumpet is blown. It is blown 100 times. The 100th trump is known as the last trump. Therefore when Paul is talking of "The Rapture" in 1 Corinthians "we shall not all sleep but we shall be changed in the twinkling of an eye at the Last Trump". That is the shadow picture fulfillment of the Feast of Trumpets. We have seen that the messiah fulfilled the passover. He was the spotless lamb. The slaying of the lamb was a shadow picture of the messiah becoming the final sacrifice. We also see that when he arose and told Mary that he had to ascend to his father, he was presenting himself as the firstfruits harvest. Again a shadow picture of waiving the sheaves of wheat as a firstfruit offering. Why then would the shadow pictures stop? They don't. When the messiah returns it will be at the Feast of Trumpets. Again fulfilling the shadow picture of watching. This time instead of just watching for the sighting of the new moon, but also watching for his return so that we are not caught off guard.

Methinks you've been listening to Michael Rood Swoon

Ok, let's bite this off one piece at a time :whew:

Quote: I myself tend to believe when the Almighty says forever it means forever.

Yes, The Lord said forever IF Israel kept ALL the commandments. They did not. They broke the covenant. So they were cursed and endured those curses. God divorced them and then He broke the covenant with them Himself.

Quote:The fall feasts are not completed.

All of the feasts were fulfilled in Christ's birth, life, death, and resurrection. That some may see a secondary fulfillment is a possibility, but if Jesus did not fulfill all the of feasts with His crucifixion, then He is not the Messiah.

Quote:Hence the uncertainty of the day and the hour. You could not just count the days. You had to watch for the moon.

The reason for the uncertainty of the day or hour is that only God knows, as Jesus explained. It is not contingent on feasts or moons, but when God has chosen it to happen.

I guess I am puzzled that if Jesus said, no man knows, yet Messianics, like Michael Rood keep guessing at the day and missing it. According to Torah, those who "prophesy" and it does not come to pass should be stoned.

The calendar is off. It is fruitless to guess what month it is, much less the day. I find it all a bit humorous that so much time is spent working out calculations that mean nothing Rollingeyes

Quote:The Feast of Trumpets is on the new moon which signaled the first day of the month. Two witnesses were needed to testify to the Sanhedrin that they indeed saw the new moon. Fires would then be lit to let the Jewish people throughout the land know that the feast had begun. Hence the uncertainty of the day and the hour. You could not just count the days. You had to watch for the moon. Now for the easy part. The Feast of Trumpets is the only feast where the trumpet is blown. It is blown 100 times. The 100th trump is known as the last trump.

Actually, the Feast of Trumpets is trumpetS, not just one. The word "terah" in Hebrew means to make a sound and then indicates that this sound is the blowing of trumpets.

Let's look at the NT fulfillment. When the angels announced the birth of Christ, the shepherds heard first one angel and then a sky full - heralding or announcing [making a sound] of Christ's arrival.

If one looks at what Paul stated, he said the sound of the Trump [one trumpet] would sound upon the Lord's return. This has nothing to do with the rapture, which is a false teaching. [see the thread in Christianity - titled: What About the Rapture? http://www.seekgod.ca/forum/showthread.php?tid=62

Also, there is nothing in Torah about 100 trumpets. That is added information - most likely from the Talmud. I wonder who is teaching this in Messianic circles, if it's Michael ...... so much for not relying on the "sages" - shaking my head - this is not His only Talmudic or Way International teaching that he does [The Way International was a cult that he was a ranking member of for 17+ years. - see http://www.uia.net/~messiah7/spl_rood.htm for more information, and this site: http://www.seekgod.ca/rood.htm

The Scripture calls those things in the Law as a pattern, not shadow pictures [a Michael Rood concept :s] Hebrews clearly states they were a pattern of what was to come and then accomplished in Christ. There is no purpose to repeat what has been finished. By doing so, one crucifies Jesus all over again, for His sacrifice was once and for all. The feasts, as Messianics continue to promote, were based in the sacrificial system. If it goes [which it did], they are no longer valid.

I think that Jesus wants us to be doing what He has called us to do, not look at the sky for His return. As the angels said to the disciples - "why stand you gazing up into heaven?" We are to be about our Father's business, not gazing upon the ancient paths. The fields are white to harvest, and people are concerned about the feasts 14790