Pastor Or Reverend???
07-26-2009, 07:23 PM (This post was last modified: 07-26-2009 07:30 PM by sheep wrecked.)
RE: Pastor Or Reverend???
We were not trying to ban you. You seem to have trouble perceiving the difference between "attack" and "discussion". We are not in "attack" mode. We have been more than patient with you, despite your criticisms that we "just don't understand you" mentality.
In reality, we have extended a much longer "rope" than normal, hoping that with all the information that has been presented to you would persuade you to look at Scripture, rather than continue to promote the teachings and doctrines of men.
You don't seem to be real open to discussion. You are reading the posts with “pastoral eyes”, rather than with an open heart. Every one is supposed to be teachable. Pastors are no better or no worse than every other Christian - except when they hold their "office/position" above every one else which then places them in into a false teacher category.
You have shown us that you believe pastors are better, have more authority, and are the "ultimate" believers. The Scriptures proves you wrong, but you refuse to see that because you have been trained to believe that leadership has control over the flock to the point of spiritual and "calling" superiority. It's not in the text, Chris - it is not there.
Let me show you by your own words what you actually believe:
“Everything I said about the pastorate was more or less based on scripture.”
You have admitted that your beliefs are not based on Scripture but on your opinion and what you have learned through the church and seminary. The hierarchy of leadership that you promote is not in the Bible, it was developed historically through a system designed to keep the sheep in submission to aka under the control of all church authority.
We have tried, obviously unsuccessfully, to urge you to look at the Scriptures as a whole, not with bias supporting what you have been taught, but what Christ has said.
I would urge you to reconsider, because if one’s beliefs are not based solely on the Bible, which you admitted they are not, then one will be led astray by the doctrines and traditions of men.
Over 2000 years ago, Ezekiel prophesied concerning the "shepherds of the flock". Please consider these words carefully, because the system that calls you pastor, is really detrimental to the body of Christ:
Eze 34:1 And the word of the LORD came unto me, saying,
Eze 34:2 Son of man, prophesy against the shepherds of Israel, prophesy, and say unto them, Thus saith the Lord GOD unto the shepherds; Woe be to the shepherds of Israel that do feed themselves! should not the shepherds feed the flocks?
Eze 34:3 Ye eat the fat, and ye clothe you with the wool, ye kill them that are fed: but ye feed not the flock.
Eze 34:4 The diseased have ye not strengthened, neither have ye healed that which was sick, neither have ye bound up that which was broken, neither have ye brought again that which was driven away, neither have ye sought that which was lost; but with force and with cruelty have ye ruled them.
Eze 34:5 And they were scattered, because there is no shepherd: and they became meat to all the beasts of the field, when they were scattered.
Eze 34:6 My sheep wandered through all the mountains, and upon every high hill: yea, my flock was scattered upon all the face of the earth, and none did search or seek after them.
Eze 34:7 Therefore, ye shepherds, hear the word of the LORD;
Eze 34:8 As I live, saith the Lord GOD, surely because my flock became a prey, and my flock became meat to every beast of the field, because there was no shepherd, neither did my shepherds search for my flock, but the shepherds fed themselves, and fed not my flock;
Eze 34:9 Therefore, O ye shepherds, hear the word of the LORD;
Eze 34:10 Thus saith the Lord GOD; Behold, I am against the shepherds; and I will require my flock at their hand, and cause them to cease from feeding the flock; neither shall the shepherds feed themselves any more; for I will deliver my flock from their mouth, that they may not be meat for them.
Eze 34:11 For thus saith the Lord GOD; Behold, I, even I, will both search my sheep, and seek them out.
Eze 34:12 As a shepherd seeketh out his flock in the day that he is among his sheep that are scattered; so will I seek out my sheep, and will deliver them out of all places where they have been scattered in the cloudy and dark day.
Eze 34:13 And I will bring them out from the people, and gather them from the countries, and will bring them to their own land, and feed them upon the mountains of Israel by the rivers, and in all the inhabited places of the country.
Eze 34:14 I will feed them in a good pasture, and upon the high mountains of Israel shall their fold be: there shall they lie in a good fold, and in a fat pasture shall they feed upon the mountains of Israel.
Eze 34:15 I will feed my flock, and I will cause them to lie down, saith the Lord GOD.
Eze 34:16 I will seek that which was lost, and bring again that which was driven away, and will bind up that which was broken, and will strengthen that which was sick: but I will destroy the fat and the strong; I will feed them with judgment.
Eze 34:17 And as for you, O my flock, thus saith the Lord GOD; Behold, I judge between cattle and cattle, between the rams and the he goats.
Eze 34:18 Seemeth it a small thing unto you to have eaten up the good pasture, but ye must tread down with your feet the residue of your pastures? and to have drunk of the deep waters, but ye must foul the residue with your feet?
Eze 34:19 And as for my flock, they eat that which ye have trodden with your feet; and they drink that which ye have fouled with your feet.
Eze 34:20 Therefore thus saith the Lord GOD unto them; Behold, I, even I, will judge between the fat cattle and between the lean cattle.
Eze 34:21 Because ye have thrust with side and with shoulder, and pushed all the diseased with your horns, till ye have scattered them abroad;
Eze 34:22 Therefore will I save my flock, and they shall no more be a prey; and I will judge between cattle and cattle.
Eze 34:23 And I will set up one shepherd over them, and he shall feed them, even my servant David; he shall feed them, and he shall be their shepherd.
Eze 34:24 And I the LORD will be their God, and my servant David a prince among them; I the LORD have spoken it.
Eze 34:25 And I will make with them a covenant of peace, and will cause the evil beasts to cease out of the land: and they shall dwell safely in the wilderness, and sleep in the woods.
Eze 34:26 And I will make them and the places round about my hill a blessing; and I will cause the shower to come down in his season; there shall be showers of blessing.
Eze 34:27 And the tree of the field shall yield her fruit, and the earth shall yield her increase, and they shall be safe in their land, and shall know that I am the LORD, when I have broken the bands of their yoke, and delivered them out of the hand of those that served themselves of them.
Eze 34:28 And they shall no more be a prey to the heathen, neither shall the beast of the land devour them; but they shall dwell safely, and none shall make them afraid.
Eze 34:29 And I will raise up for them a plant of renown, and they shall be no more consumed with hunger in the land, neither bear the shame of the heathen any more.
Eze 34:30 Thus shall they know that I the LORD their God am with them, and that they, even the house of Israel, are my people, saith the Lord GOD.
Eze 34:31 And ye my flock, the flock of my pasture, are men, and I am your God, saith the Lord GOD.
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RE: Pastor Or Reverend??? - sheep wrecked - 07-26-2009 07:23 PM
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