David Jeremiah

[Vic]

(10-29-2011 04:05 PM)Gods Lamb Wrote:  I think there are hundreds of ministers and pastors who have been caught up in The Emergent Church teachings and Ric Warren's teachings, along with Prosperity Teachings, and "name it and claim it" teachings and etc....and have been lead astray as well as they lead their people astray. It is difficult today to find a church that hasn't some of these teachings! But, to label all as "wolves" is a little harsh, I think. A lack of discernment, yes. Deceived, yes. All wolves, no. Many wolves, yes! It is difficult today as a Christian to find a church that is not contaminated.....and even if you did find one that was not contaminated, is full of sinners saved by Grace. And I'm one of those sinners!

We need to read and study our Bible. Ask the Holy Spirit to lead and guide us as we read God's Word. Rightly divide the Word of God. Be informed of false teachings. We all can slip into being coming Pharisees, self included if we don't watch ourselves and become dogmatic. We are to judge the "fruit" by all means, but lump everyone by association is not a good thing. Are we drowning in Apostasy? YES!!!! We live in dangerous times both physically and spiritually and authentic believers in Christ are few and far between. Many people claim to be Christians, but saying so, doesn't make it so!

There is a fine line to walk in not become legalistic, something I fear for myself. I've been in churches that were and left them. Saw what it does in families.

Vic we need people like you! Who research and give us great information. I may not agree with you on everything, but I am willing to read it and digest it, and pray over it. I am not a follower but an independent thinker. And I don't mind admitting that I am not the sharpest crayon in the box, and I maybe not be as smart as everyone here, but I am always willing to "learn".

Take Care and God Bless <><

Hi Marie, Some good observations and thoughts. The problem is with leadership and false doctrine, ---how much leeway does one allow the 'shepherd' to lead the flock, over the cliff? Just to the edge? Just to the brink of error?

You are right, we are all sinners and all can be deceived and all can learn from deceptions and correct our doctrine. The problem is with these movements, like Warrens purpose and emergent and contemplative ...as one said above it's seductive and it's easily infiltrated into thinking. A little leaven really does leaven everything and allows for more and more error.

If leadership is lacking discernment and understanding of Scripture and embraces and promotes this stuff, it's time for the adherents to step away. And that person in my estimation, is no longer in a position to teach anything. Because they have been in a position of trust and seriously --in many cases, destroyed spiritual lives because of the direction they have taken those who would listen to them instead of proving all things to the Word themselves.

The Scripture about leadership is to be an example of living Christ and following and teaching sound doctrine that can stand the test of Scripture. Can there be mistakes---absolutely. But, another gospel and another Jesus is more than a mistake. It's not understanding the very essence and foundation of who Jesus Christ is, the Gospel or the Scriptures. And that is what is allowing the error of these movements. And someone who advances that, is not someone I would easily allow to present anything to me, unless it was a testimony of full repentance of those things. And merely to warn others of that error. There can still be blessing from a fellow believer who has erred in those things, but it would take some time and proving the spirit, before what they have to offer would/could be viewed as acceptable.

Paul didn't access the Christians immediately after persecuting them. It took time to teach him and for the others to be able to be open to God using him despite what he had done. Someone who has misled God's people while claiming to be of Christ, and taught another Gospel and another Jesus, and false doctrine needs to sit and be quiet and learn the foundations and prove they actually do now believe them.

I guess I have seen many who have and are misleading believers, and some change and reinvent themselves and move from one doctrinal error to another without batting an eye and the leaven is accepted by those who would listen. Some subtle, some glaring, but in the end, the compromising of beliefs destroys and takes people away from Christ. And that is unacceptable and many who say they change or repent and move on in the same teaching capacity--really don't see what they have done. And that means to me that they really haven't learned from it.

Thanks for the encouragement. I;ve been appreciating your posts. If you take nothing from this website but this, know it's about Christ, about a relationship with HIm, serving Him and being obedient to Him through the Scriptures. It's not about legalism. It's fully about Him.