How odd

[strefanash]

http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/comment...400568.ece




isnt this odd? an atheist who will not believe the gospel but thinks africans should believe it. It seems absurd to me. Either he refuses to take the medicine he himself recommends, or he thinks that africans shoulds adopt something they, like he, does not believe, which is absurd

[Rose of Shushan]

Hi Stref,
must thank you for posting that, I enjoyed that article very much. I do understand what you mean by the author being an aethist ,yet recognising the good christianity achieves and the change inside the person.

Loved the article for the points the author made.

Quote:Anxiety - fear of evil spirits, of ancestors, of nature and the wild, of a tribal hierarchy, of quite everyday things - strikes deep into the whole structure of rural African thought. Every man has his place and, call it fear or respect, a great weight grinds down the individual spirit, stunting curiosity. People won't take the initiative, won't take things into their own hands or on their own shoulders.

People are bound to such things and it permeates and taints their whole outlook, from cradle to grave.Christ truly does set people free from all these oppressions and the author,despite,having no belief in God recognises it. He sees there is something different and that it is related to Christianity and Jesus.

Sometimes ,people and aethists in particular, call Christianity a crutch that the desperate adhere to in order to find meaning in this life and to that I say I agree totally.
The difference is that the crutch is solid, real and works. There are other crutches that humanity takes hold off .But do they work, do they truly lead to fullness of life? Does heroin, do tranquilisers,does money?Do other belief systems,? The Africans have set themselves up a complicated "crutch" system. Yet here is aethist himself, declaring how he sees that the self designed "crutch " of the Africans doesn’t work. It leads to bondage, as do all the other man-made crutches.Yet the "crutch" of Jesus is different.

In places, other than our relatively free west, there is a hard price to pay often for professing belief in Jesus.Theirs is not a faith that you hold onto just because it makes you feel good/self righteous/hopeful and leave when the going gets tough.Its a living real faith that spills over into every aspect of your life,transforming ,renewing and liberating.This is what the aethist saw and its awesome.

Thanks once again Stref, I have really enjoyed that article.

[strefanash]

My perspective is that I was an atheist myself, until I was converted by that Damascus road type experience I mentioned at age 19. But even then, at that age, my thinking purported to be reasoned. Purported, I say, for atheism is irrational and the very words the Holy Spirit said to me that dark night when He met me was "YOU FRAUD"

As for the fear that permeates tribal religion, this is one thing I know about from being a member of a missionary church. It is proof that the idea that the natives are happy and should be left alone is absolute nonsense.

The idea of the noble savage, an innocent in nature uncorrupted by civililzation was championed by Rousseau in the late 18th century. It was nonsense, but i recently saw on a tv doco that this was one of the ideas beind the hippies. I was too young for that generation, but i was 10 years old in 1968, and I remember thinking at the that hippies were self righteous fools.

I did think it odd that the author should recommend christianity yet not believe it himself, but maybe God can use this to save him

[YYZ Skinhead]

This is odd, and it reminds me of my Israeli skinhead friend who knows the Old Testament by heart, yet is an atheist. In Israel they teach the Tanakh to kids in public schools (anyone trying it in this country would be lynched) because it is their history, and my friend enjoys answering queries from an American Christian about the OT. I hope God will help him regain his faith because God could really use him to teach people about the Tanakh.

[sheep wrecked]

(03-07-2009 12:20 AM)YYZ Skinhead Wrote:  This is odd, and it reminds me of my Israeli skinhead friend who knows the Old Testament by heart, yet is an atheist. In Israel they teach the Tanakh to kids in public schools (anyone trying it in this country would be lynched) because it is their history, and my friend enjoys answering queries from an American Christian about the OT. I hope God will help him regain his faith because God could really use him to teach people about the Tanakh.

What Israel teaches is based in the Talmud. Their OT is interpreted by Talmudic Rabbinical standards.

The Talmud is a polemic anti-Christ writing that denigrates Jesus. It was written to keep Jews from believing in Christ. The Talmud is considered by Rabbinic authority to be superior to, and has more authority than the OT Bible. The Talmud itself states this. So I am not sure that a "learned" Jewish person can give us much perspective on the OT. They do not have Christ, and therefore, their perceptions are skewed.

The cool thing about being sealed by the Holy Spirit is that any child of God can understand the Bible because it is spiritually discerned, not in the wisdom of man, but of God. I just love it

1 Corinthians 2:5 That your faith should not stand in the wisdom of men, but in the power of God.
1Co 2:6 However, we speak wisdom among them that are perfect: yet not the wisdom of this world, nor of the princes of this world, that come to nothing:
1Co 2:7 But we speak the wisdom of God in a mystery, even the hidden wisdom, which God ordained before the world to our glory:
1Co 2:8 Which none of the princes of this world knew: for had they known it, they would not have crucified the Lord of glory.
1Co 2:9 But as it is written, Eye has not seen, nor ear heard, neither have entered into the heart of man, the things which God has prepared for them that love him.
1Co 2:10 But God has revealed them to us by his Spirit: for the Spirit searches all things, yes, the deep things of God.
1Co 2:11 For what man knows the things of a man, save the spirit of man which is in him? even so the things of God knows no man, but the Spirit of God.
1Co 2:12 Now we have received, not the spirit of the world, but the spirit which is of God; that we might know the things that are freely given to us of God.
1Co 2:13 Which things also we speak, not in the words which man's wisdom teaches, but which the Holy Ghost teaches; comparing spiritual things with spiritual.
1Co 2:14 But the natural man receives not the things of the Spirit of God: for they are foolishness to him: neither can he know them, because they are spiritually discerned.
1Co 2:15 But he that is spiritual judges all things, yet he himself is judged of no man.
1Co 2:16 For who has known the mind of the Lord, that he may instruct him? But we have the mind of Christ.

[YYZ Skinhead]

Wow, I wasn't aware that Israeli schools polluted the Tanakh teaching with the Talmud. It makes perfect sense that this would result in unbelieving students.

[sheep wrecked]

(03-08-2009 09:33 PM)YYZ Skinhead Wrote:  Wow, I wasn't aware that Israeli schools polluted the Tanakh teaching with the Talmud. It makes perfect sense that this would result in unbelieving students.

I think that most people are not aware that Judaism, the Jewish religion, is 100% Talmudic. Israel is a Talmudic nation, even though "National Israel" could be considered somewhat secular.

Most Christians do not comprehend that although it appears that the God of the OT is the Jewish and Christian God, the Jewish religion rejects Jesus Christ and therefore; the Father [per Jesus]. Therefore; Judaism and Christianity are two separate religions.

Unfortunately, the base of the "church" is incepting Judaism practices as if they are "what Jesus practiced". This is a completely false concept, because it takes Talmudic principles not even conceived of until the middle ages and inserts them into first century practice. The Messianic movement tops the list at forcing these practices [called the Jewish perspective or the Hebraic mind set] into their religion, but it's overlapping into much of Christianity currently.

I have a couple of articles on my blog regarding this stuff - if you are interested:

http://fortheloveoftruth.wordpress.com/2...raic-hook/

http://fortheloveoftruth.wordpress.com/2...rspective/

http://fortheloveoftruth.wordpress.com/2...ly-hebrew/

and my Testimony of when I was in the Messianic Movement:

http://fortheloveoftruth.wordpress.com/ancient-paths/