This is the print version of > http://www.SeekGod.ca/ecumenicalfh.htm
Ecumenical Faith
Charisma News Service reported that YWAM, Campus Crusade and other parachurch groups are having success in NY. Are they? We rejoice in the salvation of any one person, but it needs to be real. For that, the message has to be the truth. There is no Scripture that suggests there will be a revival in the wake of terrible events, and most of these same groups are advocating that Christ will return in short order. Meaning, that they would also believe that this is the time of great tribulation. In fact Scripture reminds us that there will be a great falling away.
2 Thessalonians 2:3 Let no man deceive you by any means: for that day shall not come, except there come a falling away first, and that man of sin be revealed, the son of perdition;
The website of Christians Unite carried the September 19 article of many Christian leaders who have signed another ecumenical 'statement.' http://news.christiansunite.com/religion/religion01046.shtml
"Senior church leaders have called American Christians to repent in the light of last week's deadly terrorist attacks. They say the tragedy is a reflection of the country's "crumbling foundation," and that "we need to plead with God to forgive us."
The appeal has gone out to pastors and leaders from a wide-ranging group of ministry and denominational heads. Signatories to the statement include Campus Crusade for Christ founder Bill Bright, Focus on the Family president James Dobson, Assemblies of God general superintendent Thomas Trask, and Christian Broadcasting Network (CBN) head Pat Robertson .
The group's "Biblical Response to America's National Emergency" is expected to be read out in many churches. It says that Christians need to "repent of our past path of sin," "remember our present problems" and reach out to those in need, and "reclaim our precious promises" of revival.
The statement says that America has stubbornly rejected God and His Word, forcing prayer and the Ten Commandments out of schools, flooding the world with "unimaginable perversion" through films and television, and allowing millions of abortions. Trusting more in money than God has also "brought shame and disgrace upon our nation." Prayer is needed "that God will restore the walls of his protection around our nation."....Robertson said that he and other "700 Club" hosts had "not fully understood" remarks by Jerry Falwell on Thursday's edition of the program. According to "The Washington Post," Robertson had agreed when Falwell said he placed some of the blame for the attacks on liberal groups who had "helped this happen" because their actions had caused God to remove His protection....The controversy broke as Dutch Sheets, a national prayer and intercession leader, issued an appeal to pastors not to use the word "judgment" for fear that it would turn off people who needed comfort and help..." [Source: Charisma News Service; Leaders Urge Christians to Repent in Light of Terrorist Attacks by Andy Butcher>http://news.christiansunite.com/religion/religion01046.shtml]
Monetary or any form of prosperity is not a sign that God has protected the United States or any nation.
Proverbs 11:4 "Riches profit not in the day of wrath: but righteousness delivereth from death."
Psalm 73:3-12 "For I was envious at the foolish, when I saw the prosperity of the wicked.
4 For there are no bands in their death: but their strength is firm. They are not in trouble as other men; neither are they plagued like other men. Therefore pride compasseth them about as a chain; violence covereth them as a garment. Their eyes stand out with fatness: they have more than heart could wish. They are corrupt, and speak wickedly concerning oppression: they speak loftily. They set their mouth against the heavens, and their tongue walketh through the earth.
Therefore his people return hither: and waters of a full cup are wrung out to them. And they say, How doth God know? and is there knowledge in the most High? Behold, these are the ungodly, who prosper in the world; they increase in riches."
Christians are specifically warned against covetousness by Jesus himself.
Luke 12:15 And he said unto them, Take heed, and beware of covetousness: for a man's life consisteth not in the abundance of the things which he possesseth. 16 And he spake a parable unto them, saying, The ground of a certain rich man brought forth plentifully: 17 And he thought within himself, saying, What shall I do, because I have no room where to bestow my fruits?
18 And he said, This will I do: I will pull down my barns, and build greater; and there will I bestow all my fruits and my goods. 19 And I will say to my soul, Soul, thou hast much goods laid up for many years; take thine ease, eat, drink, and be merry.
20 But God said unto him, Thou fool, this night thy soul shall be required of thee: then whose shall those things be, which thou hast provided?
21 So is he that layeth up treasure for himself, and is not rich toward God.
22 And he said unto his disciples, Therefore I say unto you, Take no thought for your life, what ye shall eat; neither for the body, what ye shall put on.
In an ABC Radio program, 'The Spirit of Things to Come, " Rabbi David Rosen, Former President of the World Council on Religion and Peace, an all-encompassing world inter-faith body, and President of the International Council of Christians and Jews, [see: EJECT2] was interviewed Sunday 16/09/01. The name of the segment was called 'Holy Envy"
"....People are seeking spiritual meaning and purpose, although from many different ways. And I think that’s a very good thing, and very often it’s a reaction against institutionalised religion, and very often that institutionalised religion has become moribund and ossified and doesn’t deserve to have the loyalty of its followers. So I think it’s very good that we have a marketplace opportunity in which religious institutions can be challenged to prove their relevancy to their communities...I think that even if people have absolute truth claims, this does not have to mean that they can’t see something admirable in another religious tradition, or that the presence of God is not to be found there, and therefore I think that just acquainting people with one another’s traditions is a very important activity and it leads hopefully to recognition that even if there are different truth claims, and sometimes conflicting truth claims, there are some very profound values that are shared, and if we really believe in those values for the wellbeing of society, then we have an obligation to work together in order to bring their realisation of much into the reality as possible....Hopefully that will lead people to understand that ground rule of his that one should recognise, one should seek to understand the other according to the best in them, as well as according to the way they define themselves. And hopefully it also can leave room for that beautiful third rule of his which is ‘Leave room for holy envy’, that somebody can be happy about seeing something beautiful in another tradition that they might not have within theirs, and very often they do have and they’ll resonate, but you don’t have to say every time you come across something beautiful, ‘Oh yes, we have that too’, and it’s a very, I think, wonderful experience to be able to see beautiful traditions and beautiful expressions and beautiful relationships within other religious communities around the world.
...I don’t think it’s impossible for even the evangelical fundamentalist to be able to engage in inter-religious dialogue... it’s possible for people still to be able to, even though I personally would define myself as an Orthodox Pluralist, that might sound like some like a contradiction in terms, I’m Orthodox in the sense that I’m committed to the corpus of Jewish observance, but I am recognised, and it’s easy for my tradition to be able to recognise that there are legitimate alternative truth claims because of our own historical, sociological development in which in order to be able to protect our own wellbeing, we’ve been able to say basically Live and let live. But I don’t have a problem dialoguing with those who genuinely believe that they would like everybody else to be like them. I certainly think it’s easier to go more profoundly into the area of dialogue with those that would have a more a pluralistic approach...."http://www.abc.net.au/rn/relig/spirit/stories/s368113.htm
That ecumenical thinking would go along with President Bush's statement in his Address to Congress where he stated, "to Muslims throughout the world: We respect your faith. It is practiced freely by many millions of Americans, and by millions more in countries that America counts as friends. Its teachings are good and peaceful, ..."
We have Muslim friends and Jewish friends. They are very nice people in humanistic terms. But they are lost according to what Jesus said. No teaching can be called good by a Christian if it goes against what Jesus said or against Biblical truth. We also acknowledge that each person will choose to accept or reject Jesus Christ. We believe that is also true. It is not accurate to suggest that we have beliefs that coincide with others. Each religion believes itself to be true--how else would one say one believes in something. In fact if one looks at the fundamentalist view of each religion==they do not allow for other beliefs. The ecumenical movement to unite, however, removes those barriers. However, Christians believe Christ is the only way which does not allow for calling other systems right or good.
There is now a Presidential Prayer Team webpage >http://www.presidentialprayerteam.org./. The Goal is to have "2.8 million People of all faiths, races and political affiliations, " praying for the President, the Cabinet and the US nation. A telephone conversation with their Tucson, Arizona office, which is their National Communication office, revealed that this website project was the brainchild of Dr. Cornell Haan and Bill Hunter. Their secondary office is in Washington D.C.
Although no information was available concerning Bill Hunter, Dr. Cornell Haan is on staff as National Facilitator of Ministry Networks in Mission America's Coalition of the Lighthouse Movement.> http://www.lighthousemovement.org/coalition.htm The Lighthouse Movement Handbook, The Lighthouse Prayer Journal, and The Lighthouse Devotional which, "Devotionals are written by well- known Christian leaders such as Jack Hayford, Max Lucado, Henry Blackaby, Bill McCartney and Bill and Vonette Bright." are all compiled by Dr. Haan and promoted on the Lighthouse Movement main page.
The Lighthouse Movements, "Who We Are" states >http://lighthousemovement.org/whoweare.asp,
" Mission America >http://www.missionamerica.org/ >is an unprecedented Coalition > http://lighthousemovement.org/coalition.htm> of Christian leaders...Comprised of the Presidents and CEOs of 80+ denominations (with 210,000 local churches) and over 350 Christian ministries, Mission America calls for active participation in The Great Commission...Mission America’s honorary co-chairs are Dr. Bill Bright (Campus Crusade for Christ >http://www.ccci.org/), Dr. Bill Graham (Billy Graham Evangelistic Association>http://www.billygraham.org/) and Dr. John Perkins (Christian Community Development Association >http://www.ccda.org/).
Dr. Paul Cedar, Chairman of Mission America, is the former president of the Evangelical Free Church of America.>http://www.efca.org/ Dr. Cedar also serves as Chairman of the Lausanne Committee for World Evangelization and is a member of the International Board of the AD2000 and Beyond Movement, the National Prayer Committee >http://www.nationalprayer.org/ and the Board of the U. S. Center for World Missions.
The Lighthouse Movement is the major evangelism initiative of the Mission America Coalition. A Lighthouse is one or more Christians gathered in Jesus’ name, committing to pray for, care for and share Jesus Christ with their neighbors, family and friends who don’t know Him...."
The Presidential Prayer Team
The Presidential Prayer Team>http://www.presidentialprayerteam.org./ project was originally to be launched in November and updates and information are being developed for the website. As of September 27, over 50,000 people have signed up as members. The website is privately funded and an 'independent, non-profit organization.'
When asked if the White House was aware of the project, the answer was, Yes, and they are hoping that the President will endorse the project. Other endorsements will come via associates and relationships which Dr. Haan and Mr. Hunter view as reputable.
When one becomes a member, they will be receiving regular email updates as well as receiving an initial 'snail' mail welcoming package. That this is a compilation of names for another database should be obvious.
When asked if the fact that all faiths were invited to become members, did that compromise that this is a Christian venture? When looking at the National Prayer meeting the inter-faith meetings, which included Buddhists, Sikhs, Hindus, Muslims and so on, did this cause a problem?
The answer was no, that anyone can become a member, but who is allowed to endorse the project would be based on who is reputable or recognized.
Do people really believe that one must be listed in order to pray? Do people believe that one must join these things to really be spiritual or to show one's patriotism? If one does not join in the ecumenical prayer meetings, wave a flag or pledge allegiance to the flag, or enter into these types of prayer lists, are we then to be viewed as enemies of the state? Enemies of the campaign against terrorism? Enemies of what President Bush declared, "the war against evil?"
One wrote to the Presidential Prayer Team and asked,
"What are the requirements to be on the Presidential Prayer Team? Which god/gods are appropriate for us to pray to? Which religions are qualified to be included?
If we are Hindus can we pray to Krishna, Shiva and Brahma?
If Muslim can we pray to Allah?
If American Indian can we pray to the Great Spirit?
If New Age Earth Worshippers can we pray to Gaia?
If Wiccans can we pray to The Mother?
If Freemasons can we pray to The Great Architect of the Universe?
If Roman Catholic should we pray to Mary, the Queen of Heaven or various and sundry saints?
If Sufis, Zoroastrians, or other odds and ends do we pray to the gods of those religions?
If we are Shirley McLaine shall we pray to ourselves (since We are God/I Am)?
Just which of these gods/goddesses should we be praying to? Or does it matter?
Are all religions the same? Has it come to that?
Are Billy Graham and Robert Schuler correct?
Jesus said He is God and nobody comes to the Father except by Him."
The reply which came from David Bolthouse of The Envoy Group, and of the Presidential Prayer Team was, "We are not sure what you are referring to in this message, but be assured that President Bush prays in the name of Jesus. Our organization does not involve itself in determining who is praying accurately or who should and shouldn't pray. We just encourage prayers for the President from one and all" [See: David Bolthouse for a review of Envoy]
This should send up red flags to all as to what exactly the purpose of the Lighthouse Movement and Mission America is. The purpose supposedly is to 'make disciples of all nations.' That means sharing the truth that Jesus Christ is the only way to God.
Regarding ecumenicism. Good King Jehosaphat unfortunately fell for it too in II Chronicles 18:3:"..I am as thou art, and my people as thy people; and we will be with thee in the war."
God's comment was not heartening: II Chron 19:2: "Shouldest thou help the ungodly, and love them that hate the LORD? therefore is wrath upon thee from before the LORD." That does not bode well for those endorsing ecumenical prayer meetings.
One author noted, and we agree, The Apostle Paul wrote, "I determined not to know anything among you except Jesus Christ and him crucified" (1 Corinthians 2:2). The dominating principle of Christianity is "I am the way, the truth, and the life; no one comes to the Father but by me." "Christ the Savior is the only revelation of, the only spokesman for, the only Son of, and the only way to, the sovereign God."
And that means abiding by the Biblical truth that God does not answer the prayers of those who reject Him, as shown Scripturally above. It also means obeying the Scriptures, like the following:
2 Corinthians 6:14 Be ye not unequally yoked together with unbelievers: for what fellowship hath righteousness with unrighteousness? and what communion hath light with darkness?
15 And what concord hath Christ with Belial? or what part hath he that believeth with an infidel?
16 And what agreement hath the temple of God with idols? for ye are the temple of the living God; as God hath said, I will dwell in them, and walk in them; and I will be their God, and they shall be my people.I Corinthians 10:20 says "But I say, that the things which the Gentiles sacrifice, they sacrifice to devils, and not to God: and I would not that ye should have fellowship with devils.21 Ye cannot drink the cup of the Lord, and the cup of devils: ye cannot be partakers of the Lord's table, and of the table of devils. "
How is it then, that President Bush would be helped by prayers to devils? How is it that people, particularly the leaders, those naming the name of the Lord Jesus Christ, have no knowledge of this principle?
It's interesting and sad that some TV stations were citing what they believed to be an accurate prediction of the destruction of the World Trade Center by the occultist Nostradamus. This is what we received in an email and what has been read in some news reports.